RE: [ga-abuse] Complaint Against Jeff Williams

[R.Gaetano@iaea.org]

Patrick,

The ga-full came after a long period of mediation between people that wanted
a moderated list, and people that were opposing "censorship". Please refer
to the archives in early 2000.
The final agreement was that we would have a fully unmoderated list,
archived.
We take only exception on the basis of material contrary to law (that did
also happen, occasionally).
It will be therefore unwise to restart the discussions, and impose a
moderation of the ga-full. I am not sure, but I even think that the ga-list
will honour postings from non-members. Elisabeth, can you confirm/correct
this?

For the new mailing lists, I would suggest applying the same set of rules as
a default (except the number of posts, being the specific lists
work-oriented with a focus), but allowing the participants to change them
(give the freedom to the chair - subject to verification by vote if somebody
objects/requires a verification).
What I would strongly recommend is insist on:
- no x-post
- stay on focus of the list

Hope it helps.
Roberto



> -----Original Message-----
> From: Patrick Corliss [mailto:patrick@quad.net.au]
> Sent: Thursday, 19 April 2001 12:29
> To: GAETANO, Roberto
> Cc: [ga-abuse]
> Subject: Re: [ga-abuse] Complaint Against Jeff Williams
> 
> 
> Hi Roberto
> 
> Thank you for sharing that information with me.  It seems 
> what you are saying is
> that anybody can say whatever they like, as often as they 
> like, with no regard
> whasoever for posting rules, posting limits or list decorum 
> providing the are
> subscibed to ga-full.
> 
> I don't mean to be impolite but I'm sure you cannot agree 
> with this proposition.
> It brings disgrace and discredit to the DNSO GA mailing list. 
>  So far at least
> four people, not including myself,  have called a halt to 
> this behaviour
> although it could be that they were referring to the 
> activities within the
> ordinary GA List.
> 
> Can you advise me asap, if there is any sanction that can be 
> taken against
> members of the ga-full list under the present rules?  That 
> would include
> continuing the suspension from the ordinary ga list.  If not, 
> does any change to
> the rules need to be passed by the GA?
> 
> Should we set up new mailing lists, would they be covered by 
> any rules or would
> we need to pass a fresh motion for every new mailing list?
> 
> Thank you for your courtesy in providing this information.
> 
> Yours faithfully
> Patrick Corliss
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <R.Gaetano@iaea.org>
> To: <patrick@quad.net.au>
> Cc: <ga-abuse@dnso.org>
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 8:00 PM
> Subject: RE: [ga-abuse] Complaint Against Jeff Williams
> 
> 
> > Patrick,
> > Jeff Williams is already suspended.
> > This post was not in the GA list, only in ga_full (which is 
> unmonitored), or
> > received by cc + bcc addressees.
> > Roberto
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Patrick Corliss [mailto:patrick@quad.net.au]
> > > Sent: Thursday, 19 April 2001 6:24
> > > To: [ga-abuse]
> > > Subject: [ga-abuse] Complaint Against Jeff Williams
> > >
> > >
> > > List Monitors
> > >
> > > Complaint Against Jeff Williams
> > > Grounds:  Personal Attack, Insults and Slander
> > > (a)    That I made false allegations to William, Jeff, Erick
> > > and others
> > > (b)    That these allegation were made privately as a cover-up
> > > (c)    That my behaviour is detrimental to my position as co-chair
> > > (d)    That I am not a person who wishes to get some REAL 
> work done
> > > (e)    That I am not a person who wants to see some normalcy
> > > on the lists
> > > (f)    That as Co-Chair I am disrupting others in a 
> prejudice manner
> > >
> > > I would add that these are serious slanders which are very
> > > likely actionable
> > > under the law.  There is very little defence even in the
> > > American system.  They
> > > are not "fair comment" because there is no justification.
> > >
> > > Best regards
> > > Patrick Corliss
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Jeff Williams <jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com>
> > > To: <jandl@jandl.com>
> > > Cc: Danny Younger <webmaster@babybows.com>; <ga@dnso.org>;
> > > Patrick Corliss
> > > <patrick@quad.net.au>
> > > Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 3:58 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [ga] List Monitors
> > >
> > >
> > > > Leah and all remaining assembly members,
> > > >
> > > > JandL wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > For the past few days, my inbox has been inundated with list
> > > > > protocol and suspension...  Quite frankly I have better
> > > things to do
> > > > > with my time than to read these messages.  There is work to be
> > > > > done.
> > > >
> > > >   Indeed there is allot of work to be done.  But until
> > > there is an open
> > > > forum and addressing these pesky little details with 
> respect to the
> > > > Co-Chair and Erick's concerns as well as others, any work that
> > > > begins on any other WG will be disrupted by carry over from
> > > > these ongoing situations.  Surely everyone can see that 
> clearly???
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > In terms of Mr. Corliss taking action, I can 
> certainly understand
> > > > > wanting to bring this list back to some measure of decorum and
> > > > > relevant subject matter.  It is regrettable to see 
> that those who
> > > > > opposed a person's individual affiliations are now on the
> > > attack to
> > > > > remove him.  All I have seen are excessive posts from 
> those people
> > > > > with nothing constructive to offer wrt to issues 
> facing the GA.
> > > >
> > > >   The issue is not that simple Leah.  But in part it is
> > > related.  Patrick
> > > > has privately made a false accusation to William, 
> myself, Erick, and
> > > > others that he has been called on.  In his new position 
> as co-chair
> > > > this sort of behavior is detrimental to all whom wish 
> to get some
> > > > REAL work done and see some normalcy on this and any new
> > > > WG lists that may be created.
> > > >
> > > >   So these issues must be addressed post haste.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Might we forego these attempts to disrupt the list 
> and get back to
> > > > > the issues most important to the Internet and the GA in
> > > particular?
> > > > > Attempting to undermine the Chair and Co-Chair's 
> efforts are not
> > > > > going to help this body.
> > > >
> > > >   This is a matter of opinion to and extent.  If the
> > > co-chair is to be
> > > > allowed
> > > > to disrupt others in a prejudice manner, than it is a most
> > > serious problem.
> > > > It should and I contend must, be addressed post haste.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Can we please see the WG lists established so that we 
> can WORK?
> > > >
> > > >   I hope so.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Leah
> > > > >
> > > > > > Dear Mr. Younger;
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This post is a fine example of the problems with the
> > > rules in place.
> > > > > > Your first citation leads us to the rules you have
> > > cited very nicely.
> > > > > > Upon reviewing these rules one finds all in order
> > > except that there is
> > > > > > no mechanism to obtain a vote of the GA for the removal
> > > of a monitor.
> > > > > > It also does not state what type of majority vote. So I
> > > guess we can
> > > > > > assume that I may call for a vote right now to remove
> > > Mr. Corliss as a
> > > > > > list monitor, due to obvious conflict of interest, and
> > > if 11 of us
> > > > > > vote and 6 say remove he will be removed.  IN CASE
> > > THERE IS CONFUSION
> > > > > > I NOW CALL FOR THAT VOTE.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sincerely,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Danny Younger wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Certain persons appointed by the GA Chair (the list
> > > monitors) have
> > > > > > > the task of monitoring the list for posts that
> > > violate these rules.
> > > > > > > These are selected by the GA Chair for a given period
> > > of time, but
> > > > > > > may be removed from the role by the GA Chair or at
> > > their own request
> > > > > > > at any time. A list monitor may also be removed by a
> > > majority vote
> > > > > > > of the General Assembly.  Normally the appointment
> > > would be for 1
> > > > > > > year." 
http://www.dnso.org/dnso/notes/2000.GA-ga-rules.html
> > > > > >
> > > > > > In response to a call for volunteers to serve as List
> > Monitors,
> > > > > > http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc07/msg00870.html
> > I have been
> > > > > > advised of expressions of interest put forth by Bruce
> > James, Kristy
> > > > > > McKee, Alexander Svensson, Patrick Corliss, and Harald Tveit
> > > > > > Alvestrand.  Accordingly, I now appoint these
> > individuals to a one
> > > > > > year term as Monitors of the GA List.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Danny Younger
> > > > > > GA Chair
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > This message was passed to you via the ga@dnso.org list.
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> > > > >
> > > > > --
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> > > >
> > > > --
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> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > --
> > > Jeffrey A. Williams
> > > Spokesman for INEGroup - (Over 118k members strong!)
> > > CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
> > > Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
> > > E-Mail jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com
> > > Contact Number:  972-447-1800 x1894 or 214-244-4827
> > > Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> > >
> >
>