Subject: GA-DIGEST V1 #177
From: [email-masked] (GA-DIGEST)
To: [email-masked]

GA-DIGEST          Thursday, November 2 2000          Volume 01 : Number 177

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 23:14:33 +0100 (CET)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

Hello William,

On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, William X. Walsh wrote:
> Tuesday, October 31, 2000, 11:37:29 AM, you [Sandy Harris] wrote:
> 
> > I'll make a formal motion that the GA call for the resignations of the
> > directors Froomkin names if the chair tells me that is possible here.
> 
> Might be worth it just for the headline value.  "Organization Within
> ICANN calls for board members resignations"

Does this mean you will support it? I would.

- -- 
Marc Schneiders

"In re tam iusta nulla est deliberatio."
(Acta SS. Mart. Scillitanorum [AD 202]) 

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Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 14:21:28 -0800
From: "William X. Walsh" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re[4]: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

Hello Marc,

Conditionally, yes. Of course, I would have to read the actual motion.

Tuesday, October 31, 2000, 2:14:33 PM, you wrote:

> Hello William,

> On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, William X. Walsh wrote:
>> Tuesday, October 31, 2000, 11:37:29 AM, you [Sandy Harris] wrote:
>> 
>> > I'll make a formal motion that the GA call for the resignations of the
>> > directors Froomkin names if the chair tells me that is possible here.
>> 
>> Might be worth it just for the headline value.  "Organization Within
>> ICANN calls for board members resignations"

> Does this mean you will support it? I would.

- -- 
Best regards,
 William                            mailto:[email-masked]

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Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 17:36:34 -0500 (EST)
From: "Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

I'm prepared to second Harald's motion in this form, if he makes it.

On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, Harald Alvestrand wrote:

> the more interesting point is what we should propose to replace them.
> I think a motion that calls for Frank Fitzsimmons, Hans Kraaijenbrink, Jun 
> Murai, and Linda Wilson to resign from the board and leave the chairs empty 
> until the rest of the board has decided upon a procedure to fill the 4 
> seats would be more complete than a proposal to just have them resign.
> 
> The spectre of four empty seats was the excuse for leaving them on in the 
> first place. That this is worrying is something I don't understand.
> 

Me neither.

> Oh well - I might understand more after Los Angeles.
> 

Well, if you mean you'll see the old guard hanging on to control as long
as possible to deny the elected directors input into the gTLD decisions,
then maybe...

See you there (Sun-Wed only).

- -- 
		Please visit http://www.icannwatch.org
A. Michael Froomkin   |    Professor of Law    |   [email-masked]
U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA
+1 (305) 284-4285  |  +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax)  |  http://www.law.tm
                       -->It's warm here.<--

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Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 16:50:10 -0600
From: Andy Gardner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

At 5:36 pm -0500 10/31/00, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:
>I'm prepared to second Harald's motion in this form, if he makes it.

Not if I beat you to it. :^)

>
>On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, Harald Alvestrand wrote:
>
>> the more interesting point is what we should propose to replace them.
>> I think a motion that calls for Frank Fitzsimmons, Hans Kraaijenbrink, Jun
>> Murai, and Linda Wilson to resign from the board and leave the chairs empty
>> until the rest of the board has decided upon a procedure to fill the 4
>> seats would be more complete than a proposal to just have them resign.
>>
>> The spectre of four empty seats was the excuse for leaving them on in the
>> first place. That this is worrying is something I don't understand.
>>
>
>Me neither.

Becuase with 4 seats empty, the elected board members - the only ones that
deserve to be there - have a higher percentage of the vote.
>
>> Oh well - I might understand more after Los Angeles.
>>
>
>Well, if you mean you'll see the old guard hanging on to control as long
>as possible to deny the elected directors input into the gTLD decisions,
>then maybe...

Since the elected board members don't get ushered in until after the AGM
(when the big decisions have already been rubber stamped), can we have the
squatters booted BEFORE the AGM, then have 4 of the 5 elected members
replace them until after the AGM, when they take their own seats?

- -- 
Andrew P. Gardner
barcelona.com stolen, stmoritz.com stays. What's uniform about the UDRP?
We could ask ICANN to send WIPO a clue, but do they have any to spare?
Get active: http://www.domain-owners.org http://www.tldlobby.com
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 19:12:18 -0400
From: "Peter de Blanc" <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [ga] GA Chairman election

I agree that the GA should elect its own Chairman

peter de Blanc

- -----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf Of Roberto
Gaetano
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 2:59 PM
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: [ga] GA Chairman election

Roeland,

>>
>> I believe that the situation has been changed since this
>article has
>> been written, and that the GA should have the right of
>> electing its own
>> Chairman.
>>
>> What do you think?
>
>R U Kidding? I never agreed with the way that article was written
>in the first place. Nothing has changed as far as that goes. The
>GA should not only have elected its own chair, but the NC as
>well. The ICANN rewriting the NDSO charter to allow appointments
>was real bad. The NC should be electing ICANN BoD seats (I know
>it does) and the GA should be electing a NC, in its entirety.

Can I assume this to be an endorsement of the proposal of having the GA 
elect its Chairman, for the time being?

Regards
Roberto
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 15:26:26 -0800
From: "William X. Walsh" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] Slashdot on the Guinness domains case

I'm sure a lot of people here read slashdot regularly, but for those
that don't this might be of interest:

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=00/10/31/1719237&mode=thread

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Best regards,
 William                          mailto:[email-masked]

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Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 15:27:02 -0800 (PST)
From: Patrick Greenwell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, Marc Schneiders wrote:

> Hello William,
> 
> On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, William X. Walsh wrote:
> > Tuesday, October 31, 2000, 11:37:29 AM, you [Sandy Harris] wrote:
> > 
> > > I'll make a formal motion that the GA call for the resignations of the
> > > directors Froomkin names if the chair tells me that is possible here.
> > 
> > Might be worth it just for the headline value.  "Organization Within
> > ICANN calls for board members resignations"
> 
> Does this mean you will support it? I would.

As would I.

/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
                               Patrick Greenwell                          
                       Earth is a single point of failure.
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 20:31:51 -0500
From: Sandy Harris <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

Andy Gardner wrote:
> 
> At 5:36 pm -0500 10/31/00, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:
> >I'm prepared to second Harald's motion in this form, if he makes it.
> 
> Not if I beat you to it. :^)
> 
> >
> >On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, Harald Alvestrand wrote:
> >
> >> the more interesting point is what we should propose to replace them.
> >> I think a motion that calls for Frank Fitzsimmons, Hans Kraaijenbrink, Jun
> >> Murai, and Linda Wilson to resign from the board and leave the chairs empty
> >> until the rest of the board has decided upon a procedure to fill the 4
> >> seats would be more complete than a proposal to just have them resign.
> >>
> >> The spectre of four empty seats was the excuse for leaving them on in the
> >> first place. That this is worrying is something I don't understand.
> >>
> >
> >Me neither.
> 
> Becuase with 4 seats empty, the elected board members - the only ones that
> deserve to be there - have a higher percentage of the vote.
> >
> >> Oh well - I might understand more after Los Angeles.
> >>
> >
> >Well, if you mean you'll see the old guard hanging on to control as long
> >as possible to deny the elected directors input into the gTLD decisions,
> >then maybe...
> 
> Since the elected board members don't get ushered in until after the AGM
> (when the big decisions have already been rubber stamped), can we have the
> squatters booted BEFORE the AGM, then have 4 of the 5 elected members
> replace them until after the AGM, when they take their own seats?
> 
Better to have the squatters leave and put in all five elected members
before the AGM. I see no reasonable way to decide which four would replace
them.
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 19:49:13 -0600
From: Andy Gardner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

At 8:31 pm -0500 10/31/00, Sandy Harris wrote:
>Andy Gardner wrote:
>>
>>
>> Since the elected board members don't get ushered in until after the AGM
>> (when the big decisions have already been rubber stamped), can we have the
>> squatters booted BEFORE the AGM, then have 4 of the 5 elected members
>> replace them until after the AGM, when they take their own seats?
>>
>Better to have the squatters leave and put in all five elected members
>before the AGM.

Agreed, but less likely, I feel.

>I see no reasonable way to decide which four would replace
>them.

I do. If I was one of the five, I would quite happily let the other 4 be
put on the board early, just on the basis of better representation. I'm
fairly sure that at least of of the five REAL ELECTED board members would
feel the same way.

Who wants to draft a resolution? Time is of the essence.

- -- 
Andrew P. Gardner
barcelona.com stolen, stmoritz.com stays. What's uniform about the UDRP?
We could ask ICANN to send WIPO a clue, but do they have any to spare?
Get active: http://www.domain-owners.org http://www.tldlobby.com
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 08:45:25 +0100
From: Harald Alvestrand <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Slashdot on the Guinness domains case

At 15:26 31/10/2000 -0800, William X. Walsh wrote:

>I'm sure a lot of people here read slashdot regularly, but for those
>that don't this might be of interest:
>
>http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=00/10/31/1719237&mode=thread

one interesting aspect of this is that several slashdot readers (who 
normally are very anti-control, anti-corporate and therefore often 
anti-icann) did not think the decision entirely unreasonable.

Quote one, sachmet ([email-masked]):

>Let's look at the facts:
>
>      * The guy got pissed at Guinness and registered a bunch of domain names
>        that, in effect, stated Guinness sucks.
>      * Guinness got pissed and played hardball to have the domains removed.
>        The guy never responded to the WIPO inquiry - and he had A MONTH 
> to do so!
>      * The guy has registered (and had taken away) numerous other domain
>        names he registered in bad faith - the docket lists 5 other cases
>        he's been involved in
>      * Finally, instead of doing something - ANYTHING - with the domain
>        names, he posts that he took them from Guinness becasue he was pissed
>        they took his original domain to another site.
>
>  I'm sorry, but he DESERVED to have those domains taken away.

For the record: I think the ability to set up "sucks" sites (the ones that 
hold negative content about their name-holders) should DEFINITELY be preserved.
And one of my continuing sources of surprise is that the owner of sucks.com 
does not sell subdomains.
(sucks.net and sucks.org seem owned by people who aren't even aware of 
their sitename....but sucks.com is making a business out of it....)

                     Harald

- --
Harald Tveit Alvestrand, [email-masked]
+47 41 44 29 94
Personal email: [email-masked]

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 22:51:45 +1300
From: DPF <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] GA Chairman election

On Tue, 31 Oct 2000 01:41:12 -0800, Roeland M.J. Meyer wrote:

>R U Kidding? I never agreed with the way that article was written
>in the first place. Nothing has changed as far as that goes. The
>GA should not only have elected its own chair, but the NC as
>well. The ICANN rewriting the NDSO charter to allow appointments
>was real bad. The NC should be electing ICANN BoD seats (I know
>it does) and the GA should be electing a NC, in its entirety.

I would not be in favour of having the GA elect the entire Names
Council.  It means that if one constituency can gain a majority of the
GA they can make a clean sweep of the Names Council - winner takes
all.

However suggesting that the GA elect *some* of the Names Council has
considerable merit IMO.

DPF
________________________________________________________________________
<david at farrar dot com>
NZ Usenet FAQs - http://www.dpf.ac.nz/usenet/nz
ICQ 29964527
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 09:28:52 -0500
From: Jonathan Weinberg <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

At 05:36 PM 10/31/00 -0500, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:
>I'm prepared to second Harald's motion in this form, if he makes it.

	As am I.

Jon

Jonathan Weinberg
[email-masked]

>
>On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, Harald Alvestrand wrote:
>
>> the more interesting point is what we should propose to replace them.
>> I think a motion that calls for Frank Fitzsimmons, Hans Kraaijenbrink, Jun 
>> Murai, and Linda Wilson to resign from the board and leave the chairs
empty 
>> until the rest of the board has decided upon a procedure to fill the 4 
>> seats would be more complete than a proposal to just have them resign.
>> 
>> The spectre of four empty seats was the excuse for leaving them on in the 
>> first place. That this is worrying is something I don't understand.
>> 
>
>Me neither.
>
>> Oh well - I might understand more after Los Angeles.
>> 
>
>Well, if you mean you'll see the old guard hanging on to control as long
>as possible to deny the elected directors input into the gTLD decisions,
>then maybe...
>
>See you there (Sun-Wed only).
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 10:45:27 -0500
From: Rob Courtney <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] ANNOUNCE: "Pressing Issues II: Understanding and Critiquing ICANN's Policy Agenda"

Members of the DNSO General Assembly:

The Berkman Center for Internet & Society at Harvard Law School and 
the Center for Democracy & Technology have announced "Pressing Issues 
II: Understanding and Critiquing ICANN's Policy Agenda," a forum for 
discussing and debating the important issues facing ICANN at its 
upcoming annual meeting and in the future.

	TIME: 1:00 PM - 6:30 PM PST (9:00 PM - 2:30 AM UTC)
	DATE: Sunday, November 12, 2000
	PLACE: Marina Beach Marriott, Marina del Rey, Calif, USA

The event's format will consist of three moderated panels of ICANN 
activists, officials, and experts; a working schedule for the 
afternoon is attached below. The proceedings will not only be open to 
the public, but  will be webcast live with remote participation.

If you plan to take part in this event, either in person or via the 
webcast, please preregister so that we can ensure technical and 
in-room capacity. You can preregister, learn about the webcast, and 
find up-to-date information on the event, at 
http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/icann/pressingissues2000/

Feel free to email me, [email-masked], or Rebecca Nesson at the Berkman 
Center ([email-masked]) with any questions or comments 
regarding the event. And please forward this message to others 
interested in ICANN's activities.

* * *

WORKING SCHEDULE OF EVENTS

- ---

1:00 PM
"Intellectual Property and Privacy in ICANN Policy: UDRP Review and WHOIS"

Alan Davidson of the Center for Democracy and Technology will lead a 
panel discussion on the intersection of intellectual property and 
privacy concerns in the ICANN policy-making process. Discussion will 
focus in particular on review of the first year of operation of the 
UDRP and on ICANN's policy on Whois data and Whois service provision. 
Panelists will include Syracuse University professor Milton Mueller, 
ICANN general counsel Louis Touton, Mike Palage of InfoNetworks, and 
UMass Amherst professor Ethan Katsh.

- ---

3:00 PM
"At-Large Membership and Elections"

Harvard Law School professor Charles Nesson moderate a discussion on 
the role of the ICANN membership, the role of national identity in 
the ICANN policymaking process, and the import of the process and 
outcome of these first At-Large elections. Panelists will include 
ICANN board member-elect Nii Quaynor, ICANN board at-large candidate 
Barbara Simons, ICANN Chief Policy Officer Andrew McLaughlin, Asia & 
Pacific Internet Association Board Member Izumi Aizu, and others. All 
newly-elected ICANN Board members have been invited to participate.

- ---

5:00 PM

Break

- ---

5:30 PM
"New TLDs"

Following a short afternoon break, we will discuss the new TLD 
applications and analyze the application process and criteria. 
Panelists will include representatives of organizations submitting 
applications as well as outside analysts. Panelists include Chris 
Ambler, CEO of Image Online Design and Richard Forman, CEO of 
Register.com, and Cary Karp of the Museum Domain Management 
Association.

* * *

Thanks very much, and we hope to see you there.

r
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Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2000 10:49:29 -0800
From: "Bret A. Fausett" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Fuzz about Froomkin

Harald Alvestrand wrote:
> the more interesting point is what we should propose to replace them.
> I think a motion that calls for Frank Fitzsimmons, Hans Kraaijenbrink, Jun
> Murai, and Linda Wilson to resign from the board and leave the chairs empty
> until the rest of the board has decided upon a procedure to fill the 4
> seats would be more complete than a proposal to just have them resign.

There's a default procedure specified in the Bylaws: the current Board
members have the power to fill vacant Board seats by a majority vote.

So if seats become vacant, the question then becomes whether the Internet
community would perceive Board appointees filling the four vacancies as more
legitimate than the four holdover Directors (aka "Boardsquatters").

Personally, I think a complete turnover sends a strong message about ICANN's
institutional integrity and reinforces the commitments made when it was
founded. On principle alone, I would be willing to accept four Directors
appointed by the current Board as interim substitutes, even though I might
perceive those appointees as less "good," by some personal criteria, than
the departing ones. It's just a matter of principle.

So, I'd second the motion too, with full knowledge of the probable
consequence of the vacancies.

            -- Bret

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 23:33:56 +0100 (MET)
From: DNSO Secretariat <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] NC Marina del Rey agenda, 14 Nov 2000

[ cf. http://www.dnso.org/dnso/notes/20001114.NCmdr-agenda.html ]

ICANN/DNSO 
DNSO Names Council Marina del Rey Meeting on 14 November 2000 - agenda 
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------

2 November 2000

Date, time and webcast 

1. The DNSO Names Council meeting in Marina del Rey will be held 
   on 14 November 2000, 13:00 - 16:00, [@ Marina Beach Marriott, Pacific Room].

  (13:00 Los Angeles, 16:00 New York, 21:00 UTC, 22:00 CET, 8:00 Melbourne next day) 

    ------------------------------------------------------------
    Local time between 30 October 2000 and end March 2001.
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    Reference (Coordinated Universal Time)     UTC         21:00
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    California, USA                            UTC-8+0DST  13:00
    Missouri, USA                              UTC-6+0DST  15:00
    Monterrey, Mexico                          UTC-6+0DST  15:00
    Washington DC, USA                   (EST) UTC-5+0DST  16:00
    St.Thomas, Virgin Islands                  UTC-4+0DST  17:00
    Santiago, Chile                            UTC-4+1DST  18:00
    Buenos Aires, Argentina                    UTC-3+0DST  18:00
    Nouakchott, Mauritania                     UTC+0+0DST  21:00
    Brussels, Belgium                    (CET) UTC+1+0DST  22:00
    Barcelona, Spain                     (CET) UTC+1+0DST  22:00
    Frankfurt, Germany                   (CET) UTC+1+0DST  22:00
    Paris, France                        (CET) UTC+1+0DST  22:00
    Seoul, Korea                               UTC+9+0DST   6:00 next day
    Tokyo, Japan                               UTC+9+0DST   6:00 next day
    Melbourne, Australia                      UTC+10+1DST   8:00 next day
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    The DST starts/ends on last Sunday of March 2001, 2:00 or 3:00 local time
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    For other places see http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/

2. The NC will be webcast by Berkman Center, thanks to Ben Edelman 
    [email-masked] 

    Access will be via http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/icann/la2000/ as usual. 
    Requires RealPlayer 5.0 or later and a 14.4Kbps or faster modem. 

Agenda 

1. Roll call

2. Review & Adoption of minutes of previous meetings

3. Results of the Review questionnaire (Theresa Swinehart) - 30 mins

4. Outline Business Plan (Philip Sheppard and Erica Roberts ) - 30 min 
   to include revision to the UDRP (Caroline Chicoine) - 30 min

Break - 20 min

5. Net user trust: gTLDs and intellectual property (Roger Cochetti) - 30 min 

6. Who Is? (Paul Kane) - 30 mins

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------

             Information from:© DNSO Names Council

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------------------------------

End of GA-DIGEST V1 #177
************************