Subject: GA-DIGEST V1 #1719
From: [email-masked] (GA-DIGEST)
To: [email-masked]

GA-DIGEST           Tuesday, June 10 2003           Volume 01 : Number 1719

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:12:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

Why shouldn't USER populations matter?  Why is land more significant than
people?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, Jeanette Hofmann wrote:

> On 8 Jun 2003 at 16:24, Marc Schneiders wrote:
> 
> > The 5 regions used by ICANN to ascertain geographical representation have
> > made me uncomfortable for several reasons. One of these is that they are
> > not nearly of equal size in whatever way you measure that size
> > (inhabitants, internet users, size of territory).
> 
> Dear Marc, it is not always size that matters.  
> > 
> > A few days ago a revised version of the allocation of countries and
> > territories has been put up on the ICANN website. It will be discussed in
> > Montreal.
> > 
> > http://www.icann.org/montreal/geo-regions-topic.html
> > 
> > If I understand it, Bermuda and the Falkland Islands are now in Europe.
> > The same is true for some French territories. Please, note that the
> > European Union does think that some of these countries/territories are
> > in Europe and others not. (http://europa.eu.int/abc/maps/index_nl.htm)
> > 
> > The reason seems to be the citizenship of the people who live there.  I
> > don't know about Bermuda and the Falklands, but the two former Dutch
> > colonies, which are also in 'Europe' now, elect their own parliament etc.
> > They are independent politically.  The Dutch government does not speak for
> > Aruba or the Netherlands Antilles. It fights with them occasionally.
> > 
> > Is this change to the regions not a step back to colonialism?
> > 
> > Anyway, what I would really like to see, is a more balanced regional
> > division. Look at the 'facts' (population and territory) of the present
> > regions within ICANN:
> > 
> > Asia-Pacific			3798		15,568
> > Africa                           840		11,698
> > Europa				 728		 8,875
> > Latin America-Caribbean		 531		 7,964
> > North America			 319		 7,699
> > 
> > (Source: http://www.prb.org/pdf/WorldPopulationDS02_Eng.pdf)
> 
> If you choose population as the criteria, half of the board should be determined 
> by Asia pacific. 
> 
> > 
> > The proposed changes don't influence these numbers much as they concern
> > mainly small islands. There is no improvement in them, as far as I can
> > see.
> > 
> > Some may find it important to take the number of internet users into
> > account. Here are some data (for what they are worth):
> > 
> > Europe          190
> > Asia/Pacific    187
> > US/Canada       183
> > Latin America   33
> > Africa          6
> > Middle East     5
> > 
> > (Source: http://www.nua.ie/surveys/how_many_online/)
> > 
> > This would suggest 3 regions not 5:
> > 
> > America                         216
> > Europe, Africa                  196
> > Asia/Pacific/Middle East        192
> 
> Your proposal implies a lack of independent representation for Africa and the 
> Middle East as well. In this sense, your model reproduces the digital divide. 
> 
> It also implies that the cut of regions would have to be adjusted quite often due to 
> changing user populations. Sounds like a lot of trouble to me. 
> 
> Besides, your "balanced regional division" lacks any notion of qualitative criteria 
> such as culture. 
> 
> Jeanette 
> 
> 
> > 
> > 
> > --
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> > 
> 
> 
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		Please visit http://www.icannwatch.org
A. Michael Froomkin   |    Professor of Law    |   [email-masked]
U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA
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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 20:33:04 +0100
From: "Richard Henderson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

That's the most sensible thing I've read all day.

Local and national At Large / User Groups will develop their own identity,
and it's not really for ICANN to define regional catchment areas at all.

Real participation is bottom up, not top down.

ALAC and its RALOs should be abandoned, and the real At Large - as an
alliance and network of groups - should be left to develop naturally,
meeting the needs of local users, not the needs of the ICANN Board for
legitimacy.

Yrs,
Richard Henderson

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Asaad Y. Alnajjar - Millennium Inc. <[email-masked]>
To: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>; General Assembly of the DNSO
<[email-masked]>
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2003 5:40 PM
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

> We need to increase the number of regions and allow each region to evolve
and
> expand to parallel paths of the other regions.
>
> For example, The Middle East, it has been always included with Asia/Africa
and
> this caused massive delay and damage to advancing the Arabic Domain Name
> standardization and the official launch of Arabic URLs.
>
> Many of us did in fact reach out to ICANN since the year 2001 and had
repeatedly
> explained this need, however, no genuine action has taken place nor any
real
> effort shown to even consider this in the near future. In the end what
will
> happen is each group will independently develop their own regardless of
ICANN's
> regions.
>
> Regards,
>
> Asaad Alnajjar
> CEO Millennium Inc.
> Founding member MINC / AINC

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Date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 22:11:16 +0200
From: "Jeanette Hofmann" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On 8 Jun 2003 at 15:12, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:

> 
> Why shouldn't USER populations matter?  Why is land more significant than
> people?

I hope I didn't say that land matters more than user populations. What I meant to 
say is that representation shouldn't be regarded as a pure quantitative issue. 
Cultural diversity is also an important factor. 

Jeanette
> 
> On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, Jeanette Hofmann wrote:
> 
> > On 8 Jun 2003 at 16:24, Marc Schneiders wrote:
> > 
> > > The 5 regions used by ICANN to ascertain geographical representation have
> > > made me uncomfortable for several reasons. One of these is that they are
> > > not nearly of equal size in whatever way you measure that size
> > > (inhabitants, internet users, size of territory).
> > 
> > Dear Marc, it is not always size that matters.  
> > > 
> > > A few days ago a revised version of the allocation of countries and
> > > territories has been put up on the ICANN website. It will be discussed in
> > > Montreal.
> > > 
> > > http://www.icann.org/montreal/geo-regions-topic.html
> > > 
> > > If I understand it, Bermuda and the Falkland Islands are now in Europe.
> > > The same is true for some French territories. Please, note that the
> > > European Union does think that some of these countries/territories are
> > > in Europe and others not. (http://europa.eu.int/abc/maps/index_nl.htm)
> > > 
> > > The reason seems to be the citizenship of the people who live there.  I
> > > don't know about Bermuda and the Falklands, but the two former Dutch
> > > colonies, which are also in 'Europe' now, elect their own parliament etc.
> > > They are independent politically.  The Dutch government does not speak for
> > > Aruba or the Netherlands Antilles. It fights with them occasionally.
> > > 
> > > Is this change to the regions not a step back to colonialism?
> > > 
> > > Anyway, what I would really like to see, is a more balanced regional
> > > division. Look at the 'facts' (population and territory) of the present
> > > regions within ICANN:
> > > 
> > > Asia-Pacific			3798		15,568
> > > Africa                           840		11,698
> > > Europa				 728		 8,875
> > > Latin America-Caribbean		 531		 7,964
> > > North America			 319		 7,699
> > > 
> > > (Source: http://www.prb.org/pdf/WorldPopulationDS02_Eng.pdf)
> > 
> > If you choose population as the criteria, half of the board should be determined 
> > by Asia pacific. 
> > 
> > > 
> > > The proposed changes don't influence these numbers much as they concern
> > > mainly small islands. There is no improvement in them, as far as I can
> > > see.
> > > 
> > > Some may find it important to take the number of internet users into
> > > account. Here are some data (for what they are worth):
> > > 
> > > Europe          190
> > > Asia/Pacific    187
> > > US/Canada       183
> > > Latin America   33
> > > Africa          6
> > > Middle East     5
> > > 
> > > (Source: http://www.nua.ie/surveys/how_many_online/)
> > > 
> > > This would suggest 3 regions not 5:
> > > 
> > > America                         216
> > > Europe, Africa                  196
> > > Asia/Pacific/Middle East        192
> > 
> > Your proposal implies a lack of independent representation for Africa and the 
> > Middle East as well. In this sense, your model reproduces the digital divide. 
> > 
> > It also implies that the cut of regions would have to be adjusted quite often due to
> > changing user populations. Sounds like a lot of trouble to me. 
> > 
> > Besides, your "balanced regional division" lacks any notion of qualitative criteria such
> > as culture. 
> > 
> > Jeanette 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --
> > > This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> > > Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> > > ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
> > > Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > --
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> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
>   Please visit http://www.icannwatch.org
> A. Michael Froomkin   |    Professor of Law    |   [email-masked]
> U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA
> +1 (305) 284-4285  |  +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax)  |  http://www.law.tm
>                         -->It's hot here.<--
> 

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 22:27:23 +0200 (CEST)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 19:34 [=GMT+0200], Jeanette Hofmann wrote:
> On 8 Jun 2003 at 16:24, Marc Schneiders wrote:
>
> > The 5 regions used by ICANN to ascertain geographical representation have
> > made me uncomfortable for several reasons. One of these is that they are
> > not nearly of equal size in whatever way you measure that size
> > (inhabitants, internet users, size of territory).
>
> Dear Marc, it is not always size that matters.

As a theologian by trade I was convinced of that the first 30 years of my
life. And I still see why it is nice to think so. People from other
disciplines, however, have come up with the idea of democracy, one woman,
one vote, two million people, two million votes. Do you want to give that
up?

> > Asia-Pacific			3798		15,568
> > Africa                           840		11,698
> > Europa				 728		 8,875
> > Latin America-Caribbean		 531		 7,964
> > North America			 319		 7,699
> >
> > (Source: http://www.prb.org/pdf/WorldPopulationDS02_Eng.pdf)
>
> If you choose population as the criteria, half of the board should be determined
> by Asia pacific.

"It is not always size that matters."

The point I tried to make (but I apparently failed): We need more than
cosmetic changes to the regions. You seem to support that.

> > Some may find it important to take the number of internet users into
> > account. Here are some data (for what they are worth):
> >
> > Europe          190
> > Asia/Pacific    187
> > US/Canada       183
> > Latin America   33
> > Africa          6
> > Middle East     5
> >
> > (Source: http://www.nua.ie/surveys/how_many_online/)
> >
> > This would suggest 3 regions not 5:
> >
> > America                         216
> > Europe, Africa                  196
> > Asia/Pacific/Middle East        192
>
> Your proposal implies a lack of independent representation for Africa and the
> Middle East as well.

Not at all. For in ICANN the regions do not elect board members or members
of the SO councils. They are merely taken into account by those who do.
ALAC is different, I know, but there 3 regions with 3 reps from each
region might lead to more diversity that 5 with 2.

> In this sense, your model reproduces the digital divide.

Another failure perhaps on my part. I thought I had transcended it. The
divisions are not along the lines of the digital divide at all.

> It also implies that the cut of regions would have to be adjusted quite often due to
> changing user populations. Sounds like a lot of trouble to me.

I found it quite interesting to figure it out. At first I thought about 7
or so, but 3 was easier. I can do it anew in 5 years. Or we can
extrapolate trends in growth of internet use now. If we go by internet
users and not people at large.

> Besides, your "balanced regional division"

I called it "more balanced" than the present. I think I am more
modest than you know.

> lacks any notion of qualitative criteria
> such as culture.

With my background I must be all for those. How do we vote on qualitative
criteria? Or rather who? We in Europe think that we have extra of that
quality, this culture. In evidence I'd like to mention the European
anthem.

	Seid umschlungen millionfach
	Diesen Kuss der ganzen Welt.

[There is no official text version of the EU anthem.]

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 22:34:31 +0200 (CEST)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 15:12 [=GMT-0400], Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School...:

> Why shouldn't USER populations matter?

It should. That is why I put that at the conclusion.

> Why is land more significant than
> people?

I hope I didn't suggest that. Land is not totally irrelevant though.

Sometimes I feel like being where there is more land and less people.

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 14:18:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karl Auerbach <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:

> Why shouldn't USER populations matter?  Why is land more significant than
> people?

By-the-way, the board has not discussed this matter during the last couple
of years and its appearance on the agenda is yet another indication that 
ICANN's staff puts whatever it wants onto the board's plate.  ICANN's 
board does not lead; it is led.

		--karl--

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 23:20:57 +0200 (CEST)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 11:00 [=GMT-0500], Erick Iriarte Ahon wrote:

> 1. No pasaron nada para Africa
> 2. No pasaron nada Asia Pacifico
> 3. Quién dijo que no había colonialismo en el mundo?
> 4. Por qué no hay ningun país de otra región que ahora pase a ser LAC?
> 5. Porque de Africa y de Asia tambien pasan para Europa o Norte América?

3 (Who says there is no colonialism in the world anymore?) explains the
other 4. In the last couple of centuries only Europe (and America a bit)
did have colonies. What you never had, you cannot claim back.

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 23:24:15 +0200 (CEST)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 09:40 [=GMT-0700], Asaad Y. Alnajjar - Millennium...:

> We need to increase the number of regions and allow each region to evolve and
> expand to parallel paths of the other regions.
>
> For example, The Middle East, it has been always included with Asia/Africa and
> this caused massive delay and damage to advancing the Arabic Domain Name
> standardization and the official launch of Arabic URLs.

China is in one region. Chinese domain names don't work yet either to
anybody's (sic) satisfaction.

I agree though, that more regions as well as better divisions can be
helpful.

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 23:45:08 +0200 (CEST)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 20:33 [=GMT+0100], Richard Henderson wrote:

> ALAC and its RALOs should be abandoned, and the real At Large - as an
> alliance and network of groups - should be left to develop naturally,
> meeting the needs of local users, not the needs of the ICANN Board for
> legitimacy.

The first thing this 'alliance and network' must do to survive: agree on
the structure of the organisation. More precisely answer this question:

How to make sure that some (people, clubs, organisations, interests,
countries) cannot grab more votes than they deserve?

The structure of the new At Large may not be to our liking. But it is not
helpful to change it by suggesting to have none. Perhaps the five regions
also serve the purpose to avoid one part imposing its will on the rest?

In itself a regional system is not stupid. The number and above all the
borders are where problems may occur, and elections won. Isn't that an
issue every 10 years in the UK?

Speaking of the UK, I am an opponent of one person elected by each
constituency/region. This will put in gray, middle ground, people only. Or
we get a two party system. Both are bad. For ALAC and for ICANN. (I am not
talking about the UK. They know there very well what is best for them.)

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 23:49:59 +0200 (CEST)
From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 14:18 [=GMT-0700], Karl Auerbach wrote:
> On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:
>
> > Why shouldn't USER populations matter?  Why is land more significant than
> > people?
>
> By-the-way, the board has not discussed this matter during the last couple
> of years and its appearance on the agenda is yet another indication that
> ICANN's staff puts whatever it wants onto the board's plate.  ICANN's
> board does not lead; it is led.

You can remedy that by suggesting in Montreal that this topic be
considered in more depth including the number of regions and the division
thereof. An ad hoc board committee would not be out of place. I am not
joking.

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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 23:51:56 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Elisabeth Porteneuve <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

> For example, The Middle East, it has been always included with Asia/Africa and
> this caused massive delay and damage to advancing the Arabic Domain Name
> standardization and the official launch of Arabic URLs.

There is no relationship between number of regions or between being in that
or another region (whether defined by ICANN, or UN, or geography)
and capability to develop language specific standarization.
But men and women speaking specific language, knowledgeable in Internet 
technologies and doing their work can help and make some progress.

Kind regards,
Elisabeth Porteneuve

> Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 23:24:15 +0200 (CEST)
> From: Marc Schneiders <[email-masked]>
> To: "Asaad Y. Alnajjar - Millennium Inc." <[email-masked]>
> cc: General Assembly of the DNSO <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?
> 
> On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, at 09:40 [=GMT-0700], Asaad Y. Alnajjar - Millennium...:
> 
> > We need to increase the number of regions and allow each region to evolve and
> > expand to parallel paths of the other regions.
> >
> > For example, The Middle East, it has been always included with Asia/Africa and
> > this caused massive delay and damage to advancing the Arabic Domain Name
> > standardization and the official launch of Arabic URLs.
> 
> China is in one region. Chinese domain names don't work yet either to
> anybody's (sic) satisfaction.
> 
> I agree though, that more regions as well as better divisions can be
> helpful.
> 
> -- 
> [06] This email is really a confirmation.
> http://logoff.org/
> 
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> 
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Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 19:44:38 -0500
From: "Jim Fleming" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] "We need to increase the number of regions and allow each region to evolve..."

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Asaad Y. Alnajjar - Millennium Inc." <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

> We need to increase the number of regions and allow each region to evolve and
> expand to parallel paths of the other regions.
> 

When you say "we", it is not clear who you mean. If you mean the 0:0 .ARPA multi-level-marketing machine...
that is intimately tied to the U.S. military industrial complex...then, it is very unlikely the average person will have
any impact. Don't go searching for any weapons of mass democracy, there are none...just years of cronyism...

As long as people use the 0:0 .ARPA address space, they will be subject to...
http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipv4-address-space
http://www.caida.org/outreach/resources/learn/ipv4space/

As for allocations, regions, etc. North America represents 67% of the address space, which is like land in cyberspace.
http://www.caida.org/analysis/geopolitical/bgp2country/
As the InterNAT overlays the aging, legacy, out-dated Internet more regions can emerge and evolve...

http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/ietf/Current/msg20987.html
From: Paul Vixie <[email-masked]>
"the current system is utterly laughable and if it were proposed apriori
it would be laughed out of the room.  that which was suitable for polite
early adopters in the R&E community is completely unsuiable for the full
global population, And This Should Come As No Surprise To Anybody."
=======================================================

Jim Fleming
http://www.IPv8.info
http://www.ntia.doc.gov/ntiahome/domainname/130dftmail/unir.txt

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Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 06:43:22 -0500
From: "Jim Fleming" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] "...the board has not discussed this matter..." ?

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Karl Auerbach" <[email-masked]>
To: "Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law" <[email-masked]>
Cc: "Jeanette Hofmann" <[email-masked]>; <[email-masked]>; "Marc Schneiders" <[email-masked]>
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2003 4:18 PM
Subject: Re: [ga] Are the Falkland Islands and Bermuda in Europe?

> On Sun, 8 Jun 2003, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:
> 
> > Why shouldn't USER populations matter?  Why is land more significant than
> > people?
> 
> By-the-way, the board has not discussed this matter during the last couple
> of years and its appearance on the agenda is yet another indication that 
> ICANN's staff puts whatever it wants onto the board's plate.  ICANN's 
> board does not lead; it is led.
> 
> --karl--
> 

Karl,

With all due respect, it seems unlikely you would be able to determine what "the board" has discussed.
They, the board and staff, clearly would not likely include you in any discussions, meetings, receptions, etc.
They would also not likely jump thru hoops to make sure that you are funded to attend all of their events,
to host their telephone conference calls, and to pay others to communicate their consensus.

The 0:0 .ARPA multi-level-marketing machine is all about funding. The key people involved are not technologists,
they are funding managers. They have spent their entire careers moving government funding to their insiders.
As long as the money flows, they will be there to direct it. They fund the people who continue to keep them in
the position of funding managers. They claim to do that difficult task for the public's benefit. As long as the public
is un-educated and continues to provide the funding, the funding managers will take the money, siphon off their cut,
and pass some of it on to grow the MLM structure. They can always find puppets to pay to dance to their tune.

...follow the money...to Montreal...

Jim Fleming
http://www.IPv8.info

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Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 07:07:00 -0500
From: "Jim Fleming" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] Are the "certifications" backed by gold ?...or, are they "fiat certifications" that come from the end of a gun...?

Are the "certifications" backed by gold ?...or, are they "fiat certifications" that come from the end of a gun...?

http://www.merit.edu/mail.archives/nanog/msg10543.html
"IANA/RIR are the recordkeepers.  You should be able to get a "certified"
history of the records for an ASN, IP address, etc.  Not just the "last"
owner of record, but the equivalent of a transcript of the history of an
ASN, IP address, etc. showing all the changes to the records since their
original allocation."
=====

http://www.goldeconomy.com
http://www.goldmoney.com
http://www.e-gold.com

Jim Fleming
http://www.IPv8.info

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Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 12:58:14 -0500
From: "Jim Fleming" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] "...ICANN has no jurisdiction..." ?

http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/ietf/Current/msg21020.html
From: "vinton g. cerf" <[email-masked]>
"this is NOT an ICANN problem - ICANN has no jurisdiction at the email level."
====
"...ICANN has no jurisdiction..." ?

"jurisdiction" ???...
"1. : the power, right, or authority to interpret and apply the law.
2. : the authority of a sovereign power to govern or legislate
3. : the limits or territory within which authority may be exercised : CONTROL"
[Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary]
=====

Is ICANN now part of the U.S. judicial system ?

Does the U.S. Government now use ICANN (and the RIRs) as a tool to enforce laws ?

Is ICANN a law enforcement organization (LEO) ?

Is the ICANN staff and board briefed on U.S. Government Homeland security matters and National Security ?
====

http://www.forbes.com/asap/2002/1007/042.html
"...they were delighted when I returned later, bringing with me a platoon of Internet gurus, including Esther Dyson, Mitch Kapor,
Tony Rutkowski, and Vint Cerf. They sealed us into an electronically impenetrable room to discuss the radical possibility that a
good first step in lifting their blackout would be for the CIA to put up a Web site."
=====

http://www.isi.edu/news/LABJSchorr.html
"This is all run by government money, essentially."

Jim Fleming
http://www.IPv8.info

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Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 11:46:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: George Kirikos <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] Required Web-Based WHOIS, and Internic

Hello,

As you're aware, gTLD registrars must provide free and public web-based
WHOIS for domains registered through them.

In the case of Dodora registrar (Dodora.com), their web-based WHOIS
server is impossible to find from their home page, as folks discovered
in a long thread at the DNForum.com message forum, see:

http://www.dnforum.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=240939

Every other registrar I've used has a link on their registrar home page
(or whatever appears in the "referral URL" at the Internic WHOIS) to
their web-based WHOIS -- even AOL registrar!

So, my questions are:

1) Is Dodora in compliance with their requirements, keeping their
web-based WHOIS hidden? (we eventually found it, after a lot of effort,
at 

http://regserv5.dodora.com/drs/src/whois_domain.php

but it's not linked from anywhere on their home page).

2) Can the Internic WHOIS output be modified instead, to show the link
to the web-based WHOIS? (would seem the "referral URL" would be the
best place, or that the web-based WHOIS should have a direct link FROM
that page).

Sincerely,

George Kirikos
http://www.kirikos.com/
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Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 07:14:33 -0500
From: "Jim Fleming" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] ?:? .NAME...IN-ADDR.NAME ?

Who owns IN-ADDR.NAME ?

http://www.ntia.doc.gov/ntiahome/domainname/130dftmail/unir.txt
?:? .NAME
====

http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/registrars/Arc02/msg01436.html
Under the current arrangement I am able to register becky.burr.name.
I would prefer, however, to have a registration at beckyburr.name.
=======

Registrant:
VERISIGN GLOBAL REGISTRY SERVICES (NSTLD-DOM)
   21345 Ridgetop Circle
   Dulles, VA 20166
   US

   Domain Name: NSTLD.COM

http://root-dns.org/vuedig/vuedig_tld.php?record=NS&tld=name&submit=Submit
LRS : Legacy Root Servers : 198.41.0.4
VueDig Results : Answer = 12 : Authority = 0 : Additional = 12. 
name. 2D IN NS J3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS I3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS L3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS D3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS A3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS E3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS C3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS F3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS G3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS B3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS M3.NSTLD.COM.
name. 2D IN NS K3.NSTLD.COM.
===================================================

Jim Fleming
http://www.IPv8.info

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------------------------------

End of GA-DIGEST V1 #1719
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