Subject: GA-DIGEST V1 #122
From: [email-masked] (GA-DIGEST)
To: [email-masked]

GA-DIGEST           Tuesday, August 22 2000           Volume 01 : Number 122

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 18:59:05 +0200 (MET DST)
From: DNSO Secretariat <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] Election of ICANN Board Director by the DNSO

[ To: [email-masked] ]
[ To: [email-masked], [email-masked], GA Voting Registry subscribers ]

Since 31 July the DNSO General Assembly is in the process of selection
of ICANN Board Director.

Nominations and acceptances of candidates has been closed today, 21 August.
Five nominees accepted their nomination for the ICANN Board position,
listed below in alphabetical order:

        * Jonathan Cohen (NorthA)
        * Peter de Blanc (NorthA)
        * Jill Keogh (NorthA)
        * James P. Love (NorthA)
        * Ronald N. Weikers (NorthA)

Endorsements of candidates starts today, 21 August, and will last
for 3 weeks, ending 11 September 2000, 18:00 CET (16:00 UTC).

Endorsements should be emailed to the DNSO Secretariat at the 
following email address: [email-masked] and use 
the provided Template for endorsement:

        3a. Full name of the endorser:
        3b. E-mail address of the endorser:
        3c. Full name of the accepted nominee
            you wish to endorse:
            (specific statements of endorsements
            may also be submitted and are encouraged)

In order to be considered for the ICANN Board selection
a nominee must have the support of, at least, 10 members
of the General Assembly of the DNSO.

The DNSO Names Council will select the ICANN Board Director
between 11 and 16 September.

All information about the ongoing election is available on the 
www.dnso.org website, in the section "Sujets du jour. Important topics."

DNSO Secretariat
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 11:54:31 -0700
From: Darrell Greenwood <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

I just visited ICANN's web site to endorse someone for member nomination.

After I had successfully endorsed the candidate of my choice I found I had

1. A saved copy of a web page indicating

"ENDORSEMENT RECORDED

Your endorsement has been recorded for the following candidate:

xxxxx xxxxxxxx"

2. The endorsement count did *not* increment. It did not increment
over a 5 minute period with several reloads of the page. It has not
incremented now, 15 minutes later, with a browser restart.

I have x'ed out who I endorsed, not because I care who knows, but
because I want to keep this discussion focused on the issue.

The issue is:

How do I know that my endorsement was not simply discarded by the server?

Many thanks,

Darrell

- --
Darrell Greenwood           mailto:[email-masked]
Vancouver, BC               http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:07:18 -0700
From: Kristy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

Darrell, 

My partner had the same experience and when he tried to log back in and
endorse
his candidate a second time, he could not log in.  I saw the endorsements for
this candidate go from 28 - 29 when my partner added his; then within in
minutes the number of endorsees for this candidate was reduced to 25.  

ICANN is going to have to get someone to work out their systems for them.  We
have offered to do this probono and received no response from ICANN, so my
concern would be technical.

:)  

~k

At 11:54 AM 8/21/2000 , Darrell Greenwood wrote:
>I just visited ICANN's web site to endorse someone for member nomination.
>
>After I had successfully endorsed the candidate of my choice I found I had
>
>1. A saved copy of a web page indicating
>
>"ENDORSEMENT RECORDED
>
>Your endorsement has been recorded for the following candidate:
>
>xxxxx xxxxxxxx"
>
>2. The endorsement count did *not* increment. It did not increment
>over a 5 minute period with several reloads of the page. It has not
>incremented now, 15 minutes later, with a browser restart.
>
>I have x'ed out who I endorsed, not because I care who knows, but
>because I want to keep this discussion focused on the issue.
>
>The issue is:
>
>How do I know that my endorsement was not simply discarded by the server?
>
>Many thanks,
>
>Darrell
>
>--
>Darrell Greenwood          
<mailto:[email-masked]>mailto:[email-masked]
>Vancouver, BC              
<http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/>http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/
>
>
>--
>This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
>Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
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>Archives at
<http://www.dnso.org/archives.html>http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
>  
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:33:21 -0500
From: Eric Weisberg <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

Kristy wrote:

> ... I saw the endorsements for
> this candidate go from 28 - 29 when my partner added his; then within in
> minutes the number of endorsees for this candidate was reduced to 25.

Are these being "handled," manually?

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:41:07 -0400
From: Jonathan Weinberg <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

	The web page with the endorsement count on it is only updated three times
a day.  (They appear to have set it up so that, if you make an endorsement
and hit "back," the page *appears* to increment by one -- but it doesn't
really.)

Jon

At 11:54 AM 8/21/00 -0700, Darrell Greenwood wrote:
>I just visited ICANN's web site to endorse someone for member nomination.
>
>After I had successfully endorsed the candidate of my choice I found I had
>
>1. A saved copy of a web page indicating
>
>"ENDORSEMENT RECORDED
>
>Your endorsement has been recorded for the following candidate:
>
>xxxxx xxxxxxxx"
>
>2. The endorsement count did *not* increment. It did not increment
>over a 5 minute period with several reloads of the page. It has not
>incremented now, 15 minutes later, with a browser restart.
>
>I have x'ed out who I endorsed, not because I care who knows, but
>because I want to keep this discussion focused on the issue.
>
>The issue is:
>
>How do I know that my endorsement was not simply discarded by the server?
>
>Many thanks,
>
>Darrell
>
>--
>Darrell Greenwood           mailto:[email-masked]
>Vancouver, BC               http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/
>
>
>--
>This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
>Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
>("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
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>
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:53:47 -0500
From: Andy Gardner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

>	The web page with the endorsement count on it is only updated 
>three times
>a day.  (They appear to have set it up so that, if you make an endorsement
>and hit "back," the page *appears* to increment by one -- but it doesn't
>really.)

Sounds like the standard for ICANN

We think they're working on our behalf. They say they're working on 
our behalf. But the reality is something compeltely different.

- -- 
Andrew P. Gardner

Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:49:21 -0700
From: Jeff Williams <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

Kristy and all,

  But you also have to admit that this look a bit fishy to say the least.
Not to mention that ICANN has still not gotten all of the PIN's
out yet by their own admission and about 70% of the At-Large
Applicants cannot even participate.  This whole election should be
postponed until a independent audit can be done IMHO....

  It also looks like ICANN did not test their software out very well
indicating that their ability to manage anything technical is problematic
at best...

Kristy wrote:

> Darrell,
>
> My partner had the same experience and when he tried to log back in and
> endorse
> his candidate a second time, he could not log in.  I saw the endorsements for
> this candidate go from 28 - 29 when my partner added his; then within in
> minutes the number of endorsees for this candidate was reduced to 25.
>
> ICANN is going to have to get someone to work out their systems for them.  We
> have offered to do this probono and received no response from ICANN, so my
> concern would be technical.
>
> :)
>
> ~k
>
> At 11:54 AM 8/21/2000 , Darrell Greenwood wrote:
> >I just visited ICANN's web site to endorse someone for member nomination.
> >
> >After I had successfully endorsed the candidate of my choice I found I had
> >
> >1. A saved copy of a web page indicating
> >
> >"ENDORSEMENT RECORDED
> >
> >Your endorsement has been recorded for the following candidate:
> >
> >xxxxx xxxxxxxx"
> >
> >2. The endorsement count did *not* increment. It did not increment
> >over a 5 minute period with several reloads of the page. It has not
> >incremented now, 15 minutes later, with a browser restart.
> >
> >I have x'ed out who I endorsed, not because I care who knows, but
> >because I want to keep this discussion focused on the issue.
> >
> >The issue is:
> >
> >How do I know that my endorsement was not simply discarded by the server?
> >
> >Many thanks,
> >
> >Darrell
> >
> >--
> >Darrell Greenwood
> <mailto:[email-masked]>mailto:[email-masked]
> >Vancouver, BC
> <http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/>http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/
> >
> >
> >--
> >This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> >Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> >("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
> >Archives at
> <http://www.dnso.org/archives.html>http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
> >
> --
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Regards,

- --
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman INEGroup (Over 112k members strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail [email-masked]
Contact Number:  972-447-1800 x1894 or 9236 fwd's to home ph#
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:53:56 -0700
From: Jeff Williams <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement - More Selective Censorship Perhaps?

Eric and all,

  Does appear that they might be "Handled" manually, doesn't it?
Makes one wonder why if they are?  Shades of the last DNSO election
perhaps???  More Selective Censorship?  Rigged election?  Or just
known problems with the software that are being mishandled through
manual intervention?

Eric Weisberg wrote:

> Kristy wrote:
>
> > ... I saw the endorsements for
> > this candidate go from 28 - 29 when my partner added his; then within in
> > minutes the number of endorsees for this candidate was reduced to 25.
>
> Are these being "handled," manually?
>
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
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- --
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman INEGroup (Over 112k members strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail [email-masked]
Contact Number:  972-447-1800 x1894 or 9236 fwd's to home ph#
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:51:24 -0700
From: Kristy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

I have only witnessed a computer program working like this when someone has
their hands working it's keyboard.  I do not believe it is possible for
this to
not be human error.  Of course I live in a world of best technolgies.  And it
is possible that there was a human error made prior to me watching the votes
and this human corrected the error while I was watching.  

Johnathon Weinburg seems to have answered this with his most recent post. 
Looks like it is a very manual situation.

The votes being recorded should be immediately added to a db and the results
page would therefore be updated in real time with almost no opportunities for
error.  Having this be a manual process adds insult to injury from the Speaks
to the Geeks.

~k

At 02:33 PM 8/21/2000 , Eric Weisberg wrote:
>
>
>Kristy wrote:
>
>> ... I saw the endorsements for
>> this candidate go from 28 - 29 when my partner added his; then within in
>> minutes the number of endorsees for this candidate was reduced to 25.
>
>Are these being "handled," manually?
>
>
>--
>This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
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>  
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 19:58:15 -0400
From: "Ken Stubbs" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

tell me andy ... will the world really end if the site is only updated 3
times a day ?

mountains out of molehills.............

(sigh) ..........

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Gardner <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

> > The web page with the endorsement count on it is only updated
> >three times
> >a day.  (They appear to have set it up so that, if you make an
endorsement
> >and hit "back," the page *appears* to increment by one -- but it doesn't
> >really.)
>
> Sounds like the standard for ICANN
>
> We think they're working on our behalf. They say they're working on
> our behalf. But the reality is something compeltely different.
>
> --
> Andrew P. Gardner
>
> Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
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>
>

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 23:32:55 +1200
From: Joop Teernstra <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [ga] new constituencies

At 00:28 20/08/00 -0400, Cade,Marilyn S - LGA wrote:
>
>Joop and Robert
>
>I would have thought that the at large board members (and the other board
>members) alike have the responsibility to be concerned about the interests
>of all users -- whether they are individuals, non profit organizations,
>governmental agencies, or businesses of all sizes.  Since the Internet is
>being used by all these "types".  
>

Hi Marilyn,

Sure. The AL Board members will define their own role and concerns as they
will start to function. Ideally before their election.  
How much influence AL directors will have on DNSO policymaking is still an
open question.

>I'm not sure that consumers themselves want to be directly engaged.  I know
>that there are those who say, as activists, that they must be
>represented.... but consumers often delegate responsibility for keepign the
>trains running, so to speak, on infrastructure, to the suppliers...

I follow your train of thought very well and I must presume that you speak
here as a representative of a supplier , but don't you think that leaving
the interests of consumers in the hands of their suppliers, without any
independent representation of their own, is a little too tempting? 

On the national level, consumers have  the legislators to stand up for
them, but who but selfless activists will do it for them in a global place
like ICANN?
ICANN needs a number of such activists as directors, to balance with
business interests that are already represented.

, thinking
>they have better things to do, like run their lives, adn their businesses.
>I don't mean to be critical of the idea, just to wonder with you two about
>the practicality... perhaps we'll see from teh at large membership, what
>brings folks to stay engaged. 
>
>Individual names holders may have a different perspective, although it might
>be possible to think of them like individuals who get telephone numbers...
>most don't want to run the number allocation or standards system which
>determines how many digits, or routing algorithms.... hard to predict how
>engaged they want to be, I suspect,  until we see more from at large
>membership.  
>
Domain Names have proven to be a lot more sensitive and controversial than
phone numbers. 
New phone numbers can be looked up, by referring to the name and address.
Imagine what consumers would say if not only their phone numbers could
change when they relocate, but also their names would no longer be secure...

Naming is so sensitive because it is not an act of consumption, but of
authorship. 
The Domain Name is not just a consumable product, it is an identity.
In DNSO policymaking the owners of the identity need representation.

- --Joop--
www.idno.org
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 20:34:38 -0700
From: Jeff Williams <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

Ken and all remaining assembly members,

  No Ken it wouldn't, of course.  But I think you missed Andy's
point entirely.  The problem(s) with this ICANN Voting/nominating
system is that it is not even doing what it is supposed to do even
three times a day/24 hour period, and that many At-Large applicants
that have PIN's cannot participate because their PIN's don't work as
well as others that have yet receive their PIN's...  These problems
would constitute a serious problematic method/system for this
process....

Ken Stubbs wrote:

> tell me andy ... will the world really end if the site is only updated 3
> times a day ?
>
> mountains out of molehills.............
>
> (sigh) ..........
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Andy Gardner <[email-masked]>
> To: <[email-masked]>
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 5:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement
>
> > > The web page with the endorsement count on it is only updated
> > >three times
> > >a day.  (They appear to have set it up so that, if you make an
> endorsement
> > >and hit "back," the page *appears* to increment by one -- but it doesn't
> > >really.)
> >
> > Sounds like the standard for ICANN
> >
> > We think they're working on our behalf. They say they're working on
> > our behalf. But the reality is something compeltely different.
> >
> > --
> > Andrew P. Gardner
> >
> > Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
> > --
> > This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> > Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> > ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
> > Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
> >
> >
>
> --
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Regards,

- --
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman INEGroup (Over 112k members strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail [email-masked]
Contact Number:  972-447-1800 x1894 or 9236 fwd's to home ph#
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208

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Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 20:46:06 -0700
From: Jeff Williams <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Verification of Endorsement

Kristy and all remaining assembly members,

  ICANN and it's limited staff is a result of poor financial management
and poor judgment on the part of those ICANN Board members that
did the initial hiring.

  These obvious problems with their voting/nominating system for the
At-Large membership are a result of ignorance and incompetence
that does not inspire confidence in ICANN being able to handle
the DNS/ROOT Servers, IP Number protocol issues, and Protocol
issues on a technical level.  This program that ICANN has developed
for Voting/Nominating is several levels below these other important
areas of ICANN technical responsibility as they are mandated to do.

Kristy wrote:

> Jeff,
>
> You've absolutely got it right!  I have sent a couple of emails to ICANN
> regarding the need to go ahead and push back ALL their project deadlines.  I
> have offered to consult or develop or tech support their website and network.
> When I questioned them for sending me three versions of the same email with
> different authorizing information, they accused me of being fraudulent.
> When I
> chided them for accusing me of fraud, they sent me and apology full of
> excuses.  EXCUSES are weak.  People/Companies who rely on them are not
> companies who make their IPOs and they are not easily respectable.  I still
> believe that they are trying very hard to do their jobs and most of them are
> doing a bang up job of it.  What I don't want to do is scare off the folks
> over
> there who are trying, because I have communicated with them and know they are
> doing their best; but this has really been an imbarrasing situation for the
> United States.  We are supposedly the "Leaders" in technology.  Now I know
> better and I'm sure most of you do too; but ICANN could at least put their
> best
> foot forward and embrace technology and those of us who offer to help.
>
> :)
>
> ~k
>
>
>
> At 05:49 PM 8/21/2000 , Jeff Williams wrote:
> >Kristy and all,
> >
> >  But you also have to admit that this look a bit fishy to say the least.
> >Not to mention that ICANN has still not gotten all of the PIN's
> >out yet by their own admission and about 70% of the At-Large
> >Applicants cannot even participate.  This whole election should be
> >postponed until a independent audit can be done IMHO....
> >
> >  It also looks like ICANN did not test their software out very well
> >indicating that their ability to manage anything technical is problematic
> >at best...
> >
> >Kristy wrote:
> >
> >> Darrell,
> >>
> >> My partner had the same experience and when he tried to log back in and
> >> endorse
> >> his candidate a second time, he could not log in.  I saw the endorsements
> for
> >> this candidate go from 28 - 29 when my partner added his; then within in
> >> minutes the number of endorsees for this candidate was reduced to 25.
> >>
> >> ICANN is going to have to get someone to work out their systems for them.
> We
> >> have offered to do this probono and received no response from ICANN, so my
> >> concern would be technical.
> >>
> >> :)
> >>
> >> ~k
> >>
> >> At 11:54 AM 8/21/2000 , Darrell Greenwood wrote:
> >> >I just visited ICANN's web site to endorse someone for member nomination.
> >> >
> >> >After I had successfully endorsed the candidate of my choice I found I had
> >> >
> >> >1. A saved copy of a web page indicating
> >> >
> >> >"ENDORSEMENT RECORDED
> >> >
> >> >Your endorsement has been recorded for the following candidate:
> >> >
> >> >xxxxx xxxxxxxx"
> >> >
> >> >2. The endorsement count did *not* increment. It did not increment
> >> >over a 5 minute period with several reloads of the page. It has not
> >> >incremented now, 15 minutes later, with a browser restart.
> >> >
> >> >I have x'ed out who I endorsed, not because I care who knows, but
> >> >because I want to keep this discussion focused on the issue.
> >> >
> >> >The issue is:
> >> >
> >> >How do I know that my endorsement was not simply discarded by the server?
> >> >
> >> >Many thanks,
> >> >
> >> >Darrell
> >> >
> >> >--
> >> >Darrell Greenwood
> >>
> <<mailto:[email-masked]>mailto:[email-masked]
> et><mailto:[email-masked]>mailto:Darrell_Greenwood@mindlink.
> net
> >> >Vancouver, BC
> >>
> <<http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/>http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/><http://www.nyx.
> net/~dgreenw>http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >--
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Spokesman INEGroup (Over 112k members strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail [email-masked]
Contact Number:  972-447-1800 x1894 or 9236 fwd's to home ph#
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208

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Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 22:01:52 -0700
From: Harald Alvestrand <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Elections (Seconded)

At 10:44 18/08/2000 -0400, !Dr. Joe Baptista wrote:

>Mr. Roberto Gaetano and his side kick Harald earlier this year engagaed in
>electoral fraud.  We discovered it was intentional and premeditated.  But
>nothing was every done.

shall we have a vote on whether Baptista's unfounded allegiations of 
election fraud in an opinion poll (now THAT is a strange claim) constitute 
reason for denying him posting rights?
I'm getting tired of this.

             Harald

- --
Harald Tveit Alvestrand, [email-masked]
+47 41 44 29 94
Personal email: [email-masked]

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 01:48:37 -0700
From: Jeff Williams <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Elections (Seconded)

Harald and all,

  I think this reply will be my limit for a single days post to this list,
a rather unusual illegitimate unsupported rule that YOU and ROBERTO
have via fiat enacted, as all of us know.

  As to your question, you know, and is a matter of record, some
VERY questionable voting practices that the DNSO under your
and Roberto's selective censorship practices have occurred.
It is also known that you have a personal conflict with Joe
as well as myself and a few others that are Assembly members
of the DNSO.  Hence it seems reasonable to assume that your
seemingly obvious tone here reflects that vendetta as it applies
to Joe Baptista.  So, denying him posting rights would seem to
be out of order and not appropriate.  But of course you likely
expected me to respond in this fashion, didn't you?  >;)

  Harald, Censorship in ANY of it's forms is WRONG!!!
Some day you will learn this well known and globally
respected and accepted FACT!

Harald Alvestrand wrote:

> At 10:44 18/08/2000 -0400, !Dr. Joe Baptista wrote:
>
> >Mr. Roberto Gaetano and his side kick Harald earlier this year engagaed in
> >electoral fraud.  We discovered it was intentional and premeditated.  But
> >nothing was every done.
>
> shall we have a vote on whether Baptista's unfounded allegiations of
> election fraud in an opinion poll (now THAT is a strange claim) constitute
> reason for denying him posting rights?
> I'm getting tired of this.
>
>              Harald
>
> --
> Harald Tveit Alvestrand, [email-masked]
> +47 41 44 29 94
> Personal email: [email-masked]
>
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
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Regards,

- --
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman INEGroup (Over 112k members strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail [email-masked]
Contact Number:  972-447-1800 x1894 or 9236 fwd's to home ph#
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 02:14:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: "!Dr. Joe Baptista" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Elections (Seconded)

Harald - you and Roberto have committed fraud.  It is a fact.  No amount
of censor will ever change that.  Go ahead.  Play the usual games.  And
just to give you and Roberto extra amunition - not only are your criminal
and liers - your also horse shitters just like Jeff says you are.

There ya go - you should have enough now to pull the plug.

regards
Joe Baptista

                                        http://www.dot.god/
                                        dot.GOD Hostmaster
                                        +1 (805) 753-8697

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Harald Alvestrand wrote:

> At 10:44 18/08/2000 -0400, !Dr. Joe Baptista wrote:
> 
> >Mr. Roberto Gaetano and his side kick Harald earlier this year engagaed in
> >electoral fraud.  We discovered it was intentional and premeditated.  But
> >nothing was every done.
> 
> shall we have a vote on whether Baptista's unfounded allegiations of 
> election fraud in an opinion poll (now THAT is a strange claim) constitute 
> reason for denying him posting rights?
> I'm getting tired of this.
> 
>              Harald
> 
> 
> --
> Harald Tveit Alvestrand, [email-masked]
> +47 41 44 29 94
> Personal email: [email-masked]
> 

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------------------------------

End of GA-DIGEST V1 #122
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