Subject: GA-DIGEST V1 #111
From: [email-masked] (GA-DIGEST)
To: [email-masked]

GA-DIGEST           Saturday, August 5 2000           Volume 01 : Number 111

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 10:45:11 -0700
From: "Christopher Ambler" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] ICANN's delay

This delay is intolerable. The board voted and passed a resolution with a
timetable. Now the "staff" decides to delay? Who is the "staff" to overturn
a board-ratified resolution?

Where is the documentation and evidence for this huge decision? I call upon
ICANN to publish and disclose the "inquiries" that were received that caused
this delay. Where are the minutes of the board meeting where this decision
was made? How did the board members vote - or, as it appears, was this
indeed a decision on the part of "staff?"

Delaying a month, and cutting the application period down to less than a
month, with no prior notice, and against a board-debated and passed
resolution goes beyond any expectation of fair and open process.

Christopher Ambler

- -- ICANN's Text:

Following the ICANN meetings in Yokohama in mid-July 2000, ICANN has
received a very large number of inquiries regarding the process for applying
to sponsor or operate new TLDs.

The nature and extent of the inquiries makes clear that there is a
significant amount of confusion regarding the process for applying, the
evaluation of applications, and the following steps toward implementation of
new TLDs. The ICANN staff has concluded that to achieve a responsible
introduction of new TLDs it is important to provide the community with a
more detailed overview of the entire application process before detailed
application instructions are issued.

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Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 13:59:06 -0700
From: "William X. Walsh" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Elections

Hello Roberto,

Thursday, August 03, 2000, 5:29:24 AM, you wrote:

> Folks,

> A few days ago a call for nominations was issued by the Listadmin (see 
> http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc05/msg00223.html) with no reaction 
> so far on this list.

Disenchantment?

> There is currently only one nomination (see http://www.dnso.org/
> elections/2000.DNSO-ICANN-nominees.html for the updated list) presented.

- -- 
Best regards,
 William                            mailto:[email-masked]

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Date: Thu,  3 Aug 2000 23:30:24 +0200 (MET DST)
From: "Roberto Gaetano" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Elections

Hi, William.

>
>Disenchantment?
>

Definitively.

So what? Am I the only stubborn around that still thinks that things can
 be changed?

Regards
Roberto
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Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 14:27:47 -0700
From: "William X. Walsh" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re[2]: [ga] Elections

Hello Roberto,

Thursday, August 03, 2000, 2:30:24 PM, you wrote:

> Hi, William.

>>
>>Disenchantment?
>>

> Definitively.

> So what? Am I the only stubborn around that still thinks that things can
>  be changed?

Yes.

ICANN has made it clear, it won't change/reform.

So the only path is to dismantle it.  And you can't do that from the
inside.

- -- 
Best regards,
 William                            mailto:[email-masked]

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Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 16:36:10 -0500
From: Andy Gardner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Elections

>Hi, William.
>
>>
>>Disenchantment?
>>
>
>Definitively.
>
>So what? Am I the only stubborn around that still thinks that things can
>  be changed?

It appears so.

The GA is a farce within a farce.

- -- 
Andrew P. Gardner

Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
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Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 15:04:10 -0700
From: "Roeland M.J. Meyer" <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [ga] Elections

Roberto
> So what? Am I the only stubborn around that still thinks that
> things can be changed?

No, but you may be one of the very few that thinks the change can
come from DNSO.ORG. Right now, 158K folks think it can happen
from the At-Large membership. IMHO, that ain't gonna happen
either. Unless of course, they all gather round the BoD, at the
next ICANN convention, with a bunch of short rope, a tall tree,
and a skittish horse.

This latest series of goal-post moves pretty much did it in for
most folks.

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Date: Fri,  4 Aug 2000 00:07:12 +0200 (MET DST)
From: "Roberto Gaetano" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] ICANN's delay

Chris,

>This delay is intolerable. The board voted and passed a resolution with
 a
>timetable. Now the "staff" decides to delay? Who is the "staff" to 
overturn
>a board-ratified resolution?
>
>Where is the documentation and evidence for this huge decision? I call 
upon
>ICANN to publish and disclose the "inquiries" that were received that 
caused
>this delay. Where are the minutes of the board meeting where this 
decision
>was made? How did the board members vote - or, as it appears, was this
>indeed a decision on the part of "staff?"
>
>Delaying a month, and cutting the application period down to less than 
a
>month, with no prior notice, and against a board-debated and passed
>resolution goes beyond any expectation of fair and open process.
>

What can I add?

Maybe a parallel story.
What was the understanding (and expectations) of the people that were in
 Yokohama about member-nomination?
I heard an affirmation from the Board about a ratio 1:2 in the committee
- -nominated vs. member-nominated seats, and a 1 month member-nomination 
period.
What this turns out to be in practice (I take the example I am 
interested into, i.e. Europe) 5 pre-allocated seat on the ballot, and 15
 days (moreover in the traditional European vacation period) to get 719 
endorsements.
Additional nicety: no whatsoever answer from "ICANN Staff" to the 
questions I am repeatedly asking about modalities for submission of 
candidatures.
And, BTW, the recent instructions at ICANN's (see http://
members.icann.org/memcand.html) read:

"If you would like to submit your name as a candidate for member-
nomination, please send an email to [email-masked] to obtain 
instructions"

You would expect to receive an E-Mail in answer to your request. Well, 
good luck, I'm still waiting.

But then, as I commented few minutes ago on a different subject, "so 
what?". Didn't we know it already? And is it a sufficient reason to give
 up?

My answer is "no". And I know that yours is "no" as well. The problem is
 how to get organized to be effective, not how to express a (sterile?) 
protest.

We are on opposite sides of the fence on many subjects, but we have 
known eachother for so long that I hope you will accept my friendly 
advice.
Don't be upset, make sure you can make it with the new deadlines, be 
ready for more surprises.
In all fairness, that's what I am doing for *my* issue with ICANN.

But what do the others think?

Regards
Roberto
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Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 15:31:12 -0700
From: "Bret A. Fausett" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: [ga] Elections

> ICANN has made it clear, it won't change/reform.
> So the only path is to dismantle it.  And you can't do 
> that from the inside.

Did you really just post that on the [email-masked] list?
 
       -- Bret

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Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 00:57:23 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Mikael Pawlo <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] PIN?

Am I now the only one who still has not received the PIN for the ICANN
website?

I know about the batch sendings and everything, but I was one of the first
to register...

Getting slightly annoyed but still with regards to everyone,

Mikael

_________________________________________________________________________

  ICQ:35638414                                mailto:[email-masked] 
  +46-709-179012                              http://www.pawlo.com/

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 01:00:31 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Mikael Pawlo <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] ICANN's delay

On Fri, 4 Aug 2000, Roberto Gaetano wrote:
(---)
> We are on opposite sides of the fence on many subjects, but we have 
> known eachother for so long that I hope you will accept my friendly 
> advice.
> Don't be upset, make sure you can make it with the new deadlines, be 
> ready for more surprises.
> In all fairness, that's what I am doing for *my* issue with ICANN.

The thing is that the ICANN process due to all these changes of schedules
and agendas become very hard to overlook if you're not looking into the
development as a full-time activity. 

This is my main concern. It's not very surprising that a new organization
in a new field as ICANN suffer from some startup problems, but due to the
nature of ICANN it's increasingly important to keep the amount of flaws
and errors down to a minimum.

Best regards,

Mikael

_________________________________________________________________________

  ICQ:35638414                                mailto:[email-masked] 
  +46-709-179012                              http://www.pawlo.com/

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Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 16:15:21 -0700
From: "Christopher Ambler" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] PIN?

No, you're not. I've still not gotten mine, and I was also one of the first.

Christopher

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Mikael Pawlo" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 3:57 PM
Subject: [ga] PIN?

> Am I now the only one who still has not received the PIN for the ICANN
> website?
>
> I know about the batch sendings and everything, but I was one of the first
> to register...
>
> Getting slightly annoyed but still with regards to everyone,
>
> Mikael
>
> _________________________________________________________________________
>
>   ICQ:35638414                                mailto:[email-masked]
>   +46-709-179012                              http://www.pawlo.com/
>
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 19:21:38 -0500
From: Peter Veeck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] PIN?

I think I got one however I can not locate it.  I may well be be mistaken and my
memory of receiving it may be a figment of  MS.  I cannot find things which are
not on a hard disk with a search feature.  It would be much more convenient to
handle it all by email.  The security of sending it part by email and part by
snail mail is fallacious.  I can create any number of email addresses and
receive snail mail for any number of names.  I already receive bulk snail mail
for at least five different spellings of my name, deceased relatives, a daughter
who has not lived at home for twenty years, and a wife who is in Arizona, not to
mention the ubiquitous Occupant.

Peter Veeck

Christopher Ambler wrote:

> No, you're not. I've still not gotten mine, and I was also one of the first.
>
> Christopher
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mikael Pawlo" <[email-masked]>
> To: <[email-masked]>
> Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 3:57 PM
> Subject: [ga] PIN?
>
> > Am I now the only one who still has not received the PIN for the ICANN
> > website?
> >
> > I know about the batch sendings and everything, but I was one of the first
> > to register...
> >
> > Getting slightly annoyed but still with regards to everyone,
> >
> > Mikael
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________________
> >
> >   ICQ:35638414                                mailto:[email-masked]
> >   +46-709-179012                              http://www.pawlo.com/
> >
> > --
> > This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> > Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> > ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
> > Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
>
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 22:48:06 -0400
From: Dennis Schaefer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] ICANN's delay

Chris and Roberto--

ICANN has succeeded at snowing the lamebrains on the Commerce Committee into
endless delays.   We won't mention the US Department of Commerce, for
obvious reasons.

ICANN is an international trade cartel of intellectual property interests.
DNSO is its principle arm.

Last year Jonathan Cohen (or one of his clones) announced at an NC meeting
that businesses had a bona fide "interest" in domain names whereas
individuals had no such interest.

In fact, individuals have a higher interest -- a liberty interest. Now that
ICANN has created a new world judicial body with the UDRP, hopefully,
individuals will begin to see that cartels like ICANN are a threat to
liberty that can only be relieved by throwing out the business-dominated
machines that control them.

Regards

>Dennis Schaefer
Marblehead MA
USA

Roberto Gaetano wrote:

> Chris,
>
> >This delay is intolerable. The board voted and passed a resolution with
>  a
> >timetable. Now the "staff" decides to delay? Who is the "staff" to
> overturn
> >a board-ratified resolution?
> >
> >Where is the documentation and evidence for this huge decision? I call
> upon
> >ICANN to publish and disclose the "inquiries" that were received that
> caused
> >this delay. Where are the minutes of the board meeting where this
> decision
> >was made? How did the board members vote - or, as it appears, was this
> >indeed a decision on the part of "staff?"
> >
> >Delaying a month, and cutting the application period down to less than
> a
> >month, with no prior notice, and against a board-debated and passed
> >resolution goes beyond any expectation of fair and open process.
> >
>
> What can I add?
>
> Maybe a parallel story.
> What was the understanding (and expectations) of the people that were in
>  Yokohama about member-nomination?
> I heard an affirmation from the Board about a ratio 1:2 in the committee
> -nominated vs. member-nominated seats, and a 1 month member-nomination
> period.
> What this turns out to be in practice (I take the example I am
> interested into, i.e. Europe) 5 pre-allocated seat on the ballot, and 15
>  days (moreover in the traditional European vacation period) to get 719
> endorsements.
> Additional nicety: no whatsoever answer from "ICANN Staff" to the
> questions I am repeatedly asking about modalities for submission of
> candidatures.
> And, BTW, the recent instructions at ICANN's (see http://
> members.icann.org/memcand.html) read:
>
> "If you would like to submit your name as a candidate for member-
> nomination, please send an email to [email-masked] to obtain
> instructions"
>
> You would expect to receive an E-Mail in answer to your request. Well,
> good luck, I'm still waiting.
>
> But then, as I commented few minutes ago on a different subject, "so
> what?". Didn't we know it already? And is it a sufficient reason to give
>  up?
>
> My answer is "no". And I know that yours is "no" as well. The problem is
>  how to get organized to be effective, not how to express a (sterile?)
> protest.
>
> We are on opposite sides of the fence on many subjects, but we have
> known eachother for so long that I hope you will accept my friendly
> advice.
> Don't be upset, make sure you can make it with the new deadlines, be
> ready for more surprises.
> In all fairness, that's what I am doing for *my* issue with ICANN.
>
> But what do the others think?
>
> Regards
> Roberto
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 23:06:23 -0400
From: "Peter de Blanc" <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [ga] PIN?

Just to confirm- i DID get a PIN

Peter de Blanc
ccTLD admin for .VI

- -----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf Of
Christopher Ambler
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 7:15 PM
To: Mikael Pawlo; [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [ga] PIN?

No, you're not. I've still not gotten mine, and I was also one of the first.

Christopher

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Mikael Pawlo" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 3:57 PM
Subject: [ga] PIN?

> Am I now the only one who still has not received the PIN for the ICANN
>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 11:07:34 -0400
From: Harald Alvestrand <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re[2]: [ga] Elections

At 14:27 03/08/2000 -0700, William X. Walsh wrote:
>ICANN has made it clear, it won't change/reform.
>
>So the only path is to dismantle it.  And you can't do that from the
>inside.

quite the opposite, the inside (BoD) is the easiest place to do it from.
Provided you can get there.

                 Harald

- --
Harald Tveit Alvestrand, [email-masked]
+47 41 44 29 94
Personal email: [email-masked]

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End of GA-DIGEST V1 #111
************************