Subject: GA-DIGEST V1 #1078
From: [email-masked] (GA-DIGEST)
To: [email-masked]

GA-DIGEST          Wednesday, March 13 2002          Volume 01 : Number 1078

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 01:34:34 +0100
From: Thomas Roessler <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] GA summary 2002-09

This summary covers the DNSO GA mailing list's (and related) 
discussions and news between February 27, and March 12, 2002.

GA list archives are available online at 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/maillist.html>.  Please 
feel free to forward this summary as you believe to be appropriate.

(Please note that this summary does not claim to be complete.  In 
fact, it does so even less than the usual summaries, since I have to 
catch up two weeks of traffic.  In particular, I have refrained from 
the temptation to include all the bits about what's currently going 
on at the ICANN meetings in Accra.  - T.R.)

				Topics

(i) Structure: Reactions to the Lynn Proposal.  In a follow-up to 
the "preliminary comments" thread covered in the previous summary, 
Alexander Svensson noted that "having an Ombudsperson and a Manager 
of Public Participation sounds like a good idea." However, he says, 
"it is equally necessary to ensure public participation not only 
personally (by making it someone's job), but also structurally (by 
making it part of the ICANN process and structure)." 
<http://www.lextext.com/icann/2002/02/24.html#a187>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01165.html>

David P. Farrar suspected that the Lynn plan may "in fact be merely 
a red herring." "It is one of the oldest political tricks," he 
continues, "to propose something so extreme and controversial that 
when you finally withdraw it the masses are so happy they didn't get 
Proposal A they don't complain so much about Proposal B." It turned 
out that David was not the only one with this particular suspicion. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01163.html>

In another posting, David (who also represents the GA on the 
Structure TF) tried to analyze the "pros and cons of the Lynn plan." 
The message is written in a very concise manner, and has a whole lot 
of good points.  It's required reading in its entirety, and I'm not 
going to summarize it here. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01166.html>

Danny Younger forwarded an interesting quote from RIPE NCC's 
response to the ICANN document: "Seeing that you are proposing 
fundamental changes to ICANN and the principles behind the ICANN - 
RIR MoU, signed in 1999, we believe that in the interest of our 
members, we have to thoroughly re-assess our relationship with 
ICANN." 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01241.html>

In the following discussion, DPF suggested that the ccTLDs "should 
carry on forming their own peer association" to negotiate with the 
DoC taking "over ICANN's role with regards to any ISO3166-1 entries 
in the root".  In another posting on this, he also characterizes the 
behavior of ICANN management as a declaration of war on the ccTLDs, 
and notes that "ICANN was primarily created due to the need to 
create new gTLDs not to form some mini-UN over the ccTLDs." Looking 
for ICANN's functions with respect to the ccTLDs, he comes up with a 
list of three functions needed: 1. Update the root zone, 2. Notify 
of minimum technical standards for a TLD, 3. Establish and 
administer re-delegation when needed by the local Internet 
community.  "This could all be done very easily by the ccTLDs acting 
as a peer organization," he concludes. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01259.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01275.html>.

Another "Preliminary Statement" on the Lynn proposal was posted by 
Rob Courtney of Center for Democracy & Technology, on behalf of the 
NAIS team.  In that statement, the NAIS group demands that the 
ALSC's report should be "openly evaluated before the whole idea of 
the At Large is abandoned." It is also pointed out that ICANN Board 
action during the Accra meeting will be necessary in order to hold 
elections for new at-large directors.  The current at-large 
directors' terms end this year.  Further, the NAIS team states that 
the Lynn proposal "fails to provide adequate support" to the 
principles of "openness, transparency, inclusiveness and 
participation". 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01245.html>

(ii) Structure: icannatlarge.com.  Significant discussion took place 
concerning the icannatlarge.com effort, and the steering group 
established for that effort.  Some of that discussion concerned 
various details of the effort, at a time when the ALSC's forum list 
was unreachable.  Other discussion covered the question whether or 
not members of DNSO constituencies should be allowed to participate 
in an at large effort.  The links below are to messages at both ends 
of the spectrum of opinions raised. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01186.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01226.html>

(iii) Waiting List Service.  Ross Rader forwarded comments on the 
WLS from Michael Mann from Buydomains. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01201.html>

Abel Wisman and Don Brown proposed GA feedback on the Waiting List 
Service, which lists various observations and concerns raised by GA 
members.  The document concludes that "the GA does not support or 
endorse the WLS proposal in any manner", and suggests that attention 
be turned to the ICANN Redemption Grace document, and that policy 
and procedure for the handling of expired registrations be 
developed.  "The policy and procedure should safeguard the rights of 
Registrants during the post-expiration grace period and it should 
contain specific language designed to prevent potential abuses by 
the Registries and Registrars." 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01355.html>

The document was supported by Kristy McKee, Harold Whiting, George 
Kirikos, Hugh Blair, Sotiris Sotiropoulos, David P. Farrar, Marc 
Schneiders, William X. Walsh, and Genie Livingstone.

(iv) DNSO funding.  Verisign announced that it would redraw its 
offer to match any donations made to support the work of ICANN's 
Domain Name Supporting Organization and Names Council for up to 
$100,000. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01239.html>

Peter de Blanc followed up to state that he expects Verisign "to 
match the donations to date, as small as they may be." 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01246.html>

Elisabeth Porteneuve pointed out that she believes that an "other 
donations" item of 9050 USD in 2000 "is a donation for matching 
funds".
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01266.html>

(v) ICANN staff draft towards Mission Statement.  Alexander Svensson 
forwarded an ICANN Staff Draft titled "What ICANN Does", and 
published on March 7.  In that draft, ICANN staff describes the 
corporation's current activities. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01323.html>

The draft caused significant discussion.  ICANN director at large 
Karl Auerbach produced a shorter list of "what ICANN ought to do", 
which is considerably shorter than the staff document. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01324.html>

Elisabeth Porteneuve thanked Karl for "this excellent synthesis", 
and suggested to add IPv6 deployment to the list. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01332.html>

As a comment to Karl's posting, Peter de Blanc (.VI) noted that "it 
is truly amazing that something once done by volunteers ... now 
costs over US $5 million per year to sustain a bureaucracy that did 
not exist prior to commercialization of the Internet." "Frankly," he 
continues, "I do not see the need to pay so much for so little. Like 
there is not even a [Quality of Service] guarantee on the operation 
of the root server system." 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01325.html>

Kent Crispin (now ICANN Staff) commented that there used to be paid 
IANA staff, that the Internet was much smaller in 1995/96, and that 
"the complexity of the things that IANA/ICANN does don't scale 
linearly with the size of the Internet." Concerning the cost, Kent 
claims that ICANN is "amazingly cheap," "given the demands made." 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01326.html>

Per Kølle (.DK) responded that Kent's note was "rubbish", and argued 
that "as far as TLD's is concerned ICANN/IANA is (only) managing a 
database with +250 entries." In a different posting, Peter de Blanc 
stated his agreement. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01327.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01345.html>

In response to that, Kent noted that the cost for the .DK database 
(which Per had also quoted) was indeed quite high from a pure 
database management point of view.  "The reason it costs you $3mil 
to run your database has almost nothing to do with the size of your 
database," Kent writes.  "The cost is caused almost entirely by 
other factors.  Similarly, the costs to ICANN/IANA for running the 
root zone have essentially nothing to do with the size of the root 
zone." 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01329.html>

In another note from Karl Auerbach, he pointed out that "much is 
*still* done by volunteers." "ICANN management," he claims, "likes 
to inflate the complexity of what it is doing." As an example, he 
quotes Stuart Lynn as saying that the operation of 12 root servers 
would cost $10,000,000 per year, and compares that with own 
estimates which yield about $3,000,000 per year.  Also, he states 
that the cost ICANN itself currently incurs to run one of the root 
servers is not known.
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01340.html>

(vi) Root Server Operator MoU.  In a branch of this discussion, Marc 
Schneiders asked where the memorandum of understanding between ICANN 
and the root server operators which Karl had mentioned was 
available.  It turned out that the document seems to be unavailable. 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01365.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01370.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01375.html>.

(vii) dot-usa.  Danny Younger forwarded a Reuters news item on 
dotusa.com: The web site where users could "register" .usa domain 
names was shut down by a US court, according to the Federal Trade 
Commission.  There was then some discussion on what the decision 
could mean for various kinds of alt.roots, and where the differences 
between dotusa.com and the other alt.roots, and new.net, are.  
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01381.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01382.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01394.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01401.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01403.html>, 
<http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01404.html>.

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Thomas Roessler                        http://log.does-not-exist.org/
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Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 00:55:08 +0100
From: Thomas Roessler <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] WLS reply

On 2002-03-09 20:19:28 +0000, Abel Wisman wrote:

>Don prepared this document and I had some input to, based upon all 
>prior discussion, without to much objections we propose to send 
>this document of asap (say tonight) to VGRS.

>      Respectfully, and due to the major concerns cited above, the GA
>      does not support or endorse the WLS proposal in any manner.

>      Respectfully submitted, The DNSO General Assembly

Thanks to Abel and Don for producing and publishing this document on 
behalf of the GA.  It has my support.

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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 17:19:44 -0800
From: Eric Dierker <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] Compliments

TR & AS are doing a good job in ugly circumstances to give us as much 
information as possible.

Compliments also to the designers of the lack of information campaign. 
Other than cutting the power some more, and some actual violence to
equipment they could not do a better job.

Thanks to Andy for his great information.

It looks like perhaps we will emerge from Accra with nothing done, Whew.

Sincerely,
Eric
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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 19:32:36 -0800
From: Jeff Williams <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Organizing structure work. - Requires openness and transparency..

Thomas and all stakeholders or interested parties,

Thomas Roessler wrote:

> On 2002-03-12 15:29:48 -0500, Joanna Lane wrote:
>
> >Not that I disagree with your approach, and it's great to see a
> >positive reaction to pull everybdoy together, but is the purpose
> >of the WG to produce one definitive DNSO restructuring proposal on
> >the basis of a consensus of participants in the proposed WG? Or do
> >you think a number of mutually exclusive proposals may be put
> >forward, each of which could go forward separately?
>
> What will have to be done first is this:
>
>  - understand what kinds of proposals are out there

  WHAT proposals are out there yes.  What KIND of proposals
I am sure is not all that important.

>
>  - understand what these proposals mean
>  - document that understanding

  Most proposals that are done well are self evident as to their meaning.

>
>
> At least for the first steps, it's not really important whether we
> strive for the Great Unified Reform Plan (I don't believe we'll be
> the ones to find that one, but we may wish to keep the goal within
> sight), or whether we just try to end up with a set of distinct and
> well-understood proposals.  In fact, the latter is a necessary step
> on the way to a GURP, and it's a step to which the GA can reasonably
> try to contribute by bundling public input into the DNSO's "GURP
> process". ;-)

 Public input must be effected by good outreach.  Outreach
from ICANN and the DNSO in particular has been discouraged
on several levels as well as in several ways.  Therefore it is reasonable

to conclude that real openness and transparency are required for
these barriers to be removed or destroyed.  With the GA this would
mean that several of the GA list rules be removed or destroyed.

>
>
> --
> Thomas Roessler                        http://log.does-not-exist.org/
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
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Regards,

- --
Jeffrey A. Williams
Spokesman for INEGroup - (Over 121k members/stakeholdes strong!)
CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
E-Mail [email-masked]
Contact Number:  972-244-3801 or 214-244-4827
Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208

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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 21:02:08 -0500
From: "Peter de Blanc" <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [ga] Scribing of ICANN Public Forum and Board meeting

Where (at what URL) will this scribing be visable?

Peter de Blanc

- -----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of
Alexander Svensson
Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2002 1:37 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [ga] Scribing of ICANN Public Forum and Board meeting

Dear all,

it seems that it will not be necessary for me to take notes
on a IRC channel tomorrow and Thursday: I just talked to
one of the professional scribes which have been hired,
and they are going to scribe word for word (and get
99 percent correct, I am told) using a scribing machine
(that's probably not the right term) like court reporters.

So it looks like we're going to get a very professional scribing of the
Public Forum and Board meeting. Nevertheless, I will from time to time
join the IRC channel: irc.dal.net, #icann. 

Best regards,
/// Alexander

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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 18:17:55 -0800
From: Eric Dierker <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] FTC Ruling.

Let us look at this FTC ruling with some scholarliness.

1.    It is a commission not a court
2.    It explained some of it's thoughts in dictum which is not
precedential, but hopefully helps us understand reasoning.
3.    It is not the final word, subject to some exhaustion of
administrative remedies it may go to a US Court.
4.    It is completely predicated upon a notion of "consumer
notification" of salient realities of ability to provide that which is
offered.
5.    It has no direct bearing upon our beloved inclusive roots.
6.    It has indirect bearing in that it informs them of a reasoning of
how to honestly conduct their business, which they are clearly doing.

I think it sends a clear message that inclusive roots and mechanics such
as dotGOD are perfectly legitimate.  And I wonder if it does not set
some question as to whether the Legacy/Toy root may well be open for
liability due to deception regarding
governance/stability/exclusiveness/accessability and services.
Certainly ICANN has deceived far more than our inclusive brothers and
sisters.

If I relied upon the MOU and White Paper (which I certainly have a right
to do) have I not been deceived as we stand today?  What disclosure has
been made that we quit following them -- and so do not by a dotCOM?

The ramifications of this ruling come home to roost at ICANN not the
inclusives.

Sincerely,
Eric

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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 18:32:55 -0800
From: Eric Dierker <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] Organizing structure work. - Requires openness and  transparency..

Very curious!

How can you have openness and transparency when you are limited to a certain
number of posts per day.

On the one hand how can one disclose everything, but you already had 5
posts?  "Oops! I could not post the part about 6 BoD seats cuz I already
posted 5"

On the other hand how can you ask the questions?  "Golly gee I forgot to ask
how many seats your proposal had in it!  But Now I can't because AS will
suspend me if I do ask another smart question."

A WG with a strict limitation on postings is a TF with a broad base.  But
don't go and worry we can route around this inaness.

Sincerely,
Eric

Jeff Williams wrote:

> Thomas and all stakeholders or interested parties,
>
> Thomas Roessler wrote:
>
> > On 2002-03-12 15:29:48 -0500, Joanna Lane wrote:
> >
> > >Not that I disagree with your approach, and it's great to see a
> > >positive reaction to pull everybdoy together, but is the purpose
> > >of the WG to produce one definitive DNSO restructuring proposal on
> > >the basis of a consensus of participants in the proposed WG? Or do
> > >you think a number of mutually exclusive proposals may be put
> > >forward, each of which could go forward separately?
> >
> > What will have to be done first is this:
> >
> >  - understand what kinds of proposals are out there
>
>   WHAT proposals are out there yes.  What KIND of proposals
> I am sure is not all that important.
>
> >
> >  - understand what these proposals mean
> >  - document that understanding
>
>   Most proposals that are done well are self evident as to their meaning.
>
> >
> >
> > At least for the first steps, it's not really important whether we
> > strive for the Great Unified Reform Plan (I don't believe we'll be
> > the ones to find that one, but we may wish to keep the goal within
> > sight), or whether we just try to end up with a set of distinct and
> > well-understood proposals.  In fact, the latter is a necessary step
> > on the way to a GURP, and it's a step to which the GA can reasonably
> > try to contribute by bundling public input into the DNSO's "GURP
> > process". ;-)
>
>  Public input must be effected by good outreach.  Outreach
> from ICANN and the DNSO in particular has been discouraged
> on several levels as well as in several ways.  Therefore it is reasonable
>
> to conclude that real openness and transparency are required for
> these barriers to be removed or destroyed.  With the GA this would
> mean that several of the GA list rules be removed or destroyed.
>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Thomas Roessler                        http://log.does-not-exist.org/
> > --
> > This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> > Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> > ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
> > Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
>
> Regards,
>
> --
> Jeffrey A. Williams
> Spokesman for INEGroup - (Over 121k members/stakeholdes strong!)
> CEO/DIR. Internet Network Eng/SR. Java/CORBA Development Eng.
> Information Network Eng. Group. INEG. INC.
> E-Mail [email-masked]
> Contact Number:  972-244-3801 or 214-244-4827
> Address: 5 East Kirkwood Blvd. Grapevine Texas 75208
>
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 23:12:21 -0800
From: Sotiris Sotiropoulos <[email-masked]>
Subject: [ga] here we go...

The Sherrif's in town folks, and things just went from bad
to worse.    

House panel approves Net gambling ban...

http://news.com.com/2100-1023-858458.html

Here's a priceless quote from this deeply disturbing
article, make of it what you will:

"This legislation is badly needed because there are a
great many offshore sites that are sucking billions of
dollars from American households," said Rep. Bob      
Goodlatte, R-Va., who sponsored the bill."

I suppose the next thing the US Government will ban is
travel abroad for its citizens.  It's the logical
conclusion after this absurdity, after all, US tourism
abroad is liable to "suck billions of dollars from
American households"...  

- -- 
Sincerely,

Sotiris Sotiropoulos
	Hermes Network Inc.
	Toronto, Canada

- ----
direct: 416.422.1034

icq: 34564103
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Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 17:19:19 +1300
From: Joop Teernstra <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] GA summary 2002-09

At 01:34 13/03/02 +0100, Thomas Roessler wrote:

>Abel Wisman and Don Brown proposed GA feedback on the Waiting List 
>Service, which lists various observations and concerns raised by GA 
>members.  The document concludes that "the GA does not support or endorse 
>the WLS proposal in any manner", and suggests that attention be turned to 
>the ICANN Redemption Grace document, and that policy and procedure for the 
>handling of expired registrations be developed.  "The policy and procedure 
>should safeguard the rights of Registrants during the post-expiration 
>grace period and it should contain specific language designed to prevent 
>potential abuses by the Registries and Registrars." 
><http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01355.html>
>
>The document was supported by Kristy McKee, Harold Whiting, George 
>Kirikos, Hugh Blair, Sotiris Sotiropoulos, David P. Farrar, Marc 
>Schneiders, William X. Walsh, and Genie Livingstone.

Thomas,
You should add that 7 more GA members (myself included) expressed support 
for the document through the Polling Booth. see www.democracy.org.nz/vote1/
enter and click on "results".

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Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 20:32:58 -0800
From: William X Walsh <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] here we go...

Can someone explain to me how this has any relevance to the GA,
besides contributing to the list pollution (such as all the alt.root
talk on this list the last few days).

Tuesday, Tuesday, March 12, 2002, 11:12:21 PM, Sotiris Sotiropoulos wrote:

> The Sherrif's in town folks, and things just went from bad
> to worse.    

> House panel approves Net gambling ban...

> http://news.com.com/2100-1023-858458.html

> Here's a priceless quote from this deeply disturbing
> article, make of it what you will:

> "This legislation is badly needed because there are a
> great many offshore sites that are sucking billions of
> dollars from American households," said Rep. Bob      
> Goodlatte, R-Va., who sponsored the bill."

> I suppose the next thing the US Government will ban is
> travel abroad for its citizens.  It's the logical
> conclusion after this absurdity, after all, US tourism
> abroad is liable to "suck billions of dollars from
> American households"...  

- -- 
Best regards,
William X Walsh <[email-masked]>
- --

"There is no better way to exercise the imagination than the study of
the law. No artist ever interpreted nature as freely as a lawyer
interprets the truth."
- -- Jean Giradoux

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Date: 13 Mar 2002 04:48:41 +0000
From: Abel Wisman <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] here we go...

lessons are currently $ 250 per hour, excluding expenses and VAT/Taxes.

regards

abel

On Wed, 2002-03-13 at 04:32, William X Walsh wrote:
> 
> Can someone explain to me how this has any relevance to the GA,
> besides contributing to the list pollution (such as all the alt.root
> talk on this list the last few days).
> 
> Tuesday, Tuesday, March 12, 2002, 11:12:21 PM, Sotiris Sotiropoulos wrote:
> 
> > The Sherrif's in town folks, and things just went from bad
> > to worse.    
> 
> > House panel approves Net gambling ban...
> 
> > http://news.com.com/2100-1023-858458.html
> 
> > Here's a priceless quote from this deeply disturbing
> > article, make of it what you will:
> 
> > "This legislation is badly needed because there are a
> > great many offshore sites that are sucking billions of
> > dollars from American households," said Rep. Bob      
> > Goodlatte, R-Va., who sponsored the bill."
> 
> > I suppose the next thing the US Government will ban is
> > travel abroad for its citizens.  It's the logical
> > conclusion after this absurdity, after all, US tourism
> > abroad is liable to "suck billions of dollars from
> > American households"...  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Best regards,
> William X Walsh <[email-masked]>
> --
> 
> "There is no better way to exercise the imagination than the study of
> the law. No artist ever interpreted nature as freely as a lawyer
> interprets the truth."
> -- Jean Giradoux
> 
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> ("unsubscribe ga-full" in the body of the message).
> Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
- -- 
Abel S.H. Wisman

Scottish Provident House 
76-80 College Road
Harrow Middlesex
HA1 1BQ 
UK
+44 20 8424 2422
+44 78 1214 1916

www.able-towers.com
www.url.org
www.grid9.net
www.telesave.net

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 23:48:30 -0800
From: Sotiris Sotiropoulos <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] here we go...

Abel Wisman wrote:
> 
> lessons are currently $ 250 per hour, excluding expenses and VAT/Taxes.

Be careful Abel, or some US Government official may decide
that overseas consulting is also "sucking billions of
dollars from American households" and decide to instigate
sanctions against such practices..

> 
> regards
> 
> abel
> 
> On Wed, 2002-03-13 at 04:32, William X Walsh wrote:
> >
> > Can someone explain to me how this has any relevance to the GA,
> > besides contributing to the list pollution (such as all the alt.root
> > talk on this list the last few days).
> >
> > Tuesday, Tuesday, March 12, 2002, 11:12:21 PM, Sotiris Sotiropoulos wrote:
> >
> > > The Sherrif's in town folks, and things just went from bad
> > > to worse.
> >
> > > House panel approves Net gambling ban...
> >
> > > http://news.com.com/2100-1023-858458.html
> >
> > > Here's a priceless quote from this deeply disturbing
> > > article, make of it what you will:
> >
> > > "This legislation is badly needed because there are a
> > > great many offshore sites that are sucking billions of
> > > dollars from American households," said Rep. Bob
> > > Goodlatte, R-Va., who sponsored the bill."
> >
> > > I suppose the next thing the US Government will ban is
> > > travel abroad for its citizens.  It's the logical
> > > conclusion after this absurdity, after all, US tourism
> > > abroad is liable to "suck billions of dollars from
> > > American households"...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Best regards,
> > William X Walsh <[email-masked]>
> > --
> >
> > "There is no better way to exercise the imagination than the study of
> > the law. No artist ever interpreted nature as freely as a lawyer
> > interprets the truth."
> > -- Jean Giradoux
> >
> > --
> > This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> > Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> > ("unsubscribe ga-full" in the body of the message).
> > Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html
> --
> Abel S.H. Wisman
> 
> Scottish Provident House
> 76-80 College Road
> Harrow Middlesex
> HA1 1BQ
> UK
> +44 20 8424 2422
> +44 78 1214 1916
> 
> www.able-towers.com
> www.url.org
> www.grid9.net
> www.telesave.net

- -- 
Sincerely,

Sotiris Sotiropoulos
	Hermes Network Inc.
	Toronto, Canada

- ----
direct: 416.422.1034

icq: 34564103
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 20:58:46 -0800
From: William X Walsh <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] GA summary 2002-09

Tuesday, Tuesday, March 12, 2002, 8:19:19 PM, Joop Teernstra wrote:

> At 01:34 13/03/02 +0100, Thomas Roessler wrote:

>>Abel Wisman and Don Brown proposed GA feedback on the Waiting List 
>>Service, which lists various observations and concerns raised by GA 
>>members.  The document concludes that "the GA does not support or endorse 
>>the WLS proposal in any manner", and suggests that attention be turned to 
>>the ICANN Redemption Grace document, and that policy and procedure for the 
>>handling of expired registrations be developed.  "The policy and procedure 
>>should safeguard the rights of Registrants during the post-expiration 
>>grace period and it should contain specific language designed to prevent 
>>potential abuses by the Registries and Registrars." 
>><http://www.dnso.org/clubpublic/ga/Arc09/msg01355.html>
>>
>>The document was supported by Kristy McKee, Harold Whiting, George 
>>Kirikos, Hugh Blair, Sotiris Sotiropoulos, David P. Farrar, Marc 
>>Schneiders, William X. Walsh, and Genie Livingstone.

> Thomas,
> You should add that 7 more GA members (myself included) expressed support 
> for the document through the Polling Booth. see www.democracy.org.nz/vote1/
> enter and click on "results".

Too bad they didn't do so on the only official forum of the GA would
that support can be measured.  Their official support could have been
used.

- -- 
Best regards,
William X Walsh <[email-masked]>
- --

"There is no better way to exercise the imagination than the study of
the law. No artist ever interpreted nature as freely as a lawyer
interprets the truth."
- -- Jean Giradoux

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 21:13:05 -0800
From: Eric Dierker <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [ga] here we go...

Well said friend.  These misguided poor individuals must be corrected in
their misunderstanding of our net.
Don't worry we are on them like stink on Stuart Lynn.

E

Sotiris Sotiropoulos wrote:

> The Sherrif's in town folks, and things just went from bad
> to worse.
>
> House panel approves Net gambling ban...
>
> http://news.com.com/2100-1023-858458.html
>
> Here's a priceless quote from this deeply disturbing
> article, make of it what you will:
>
> "This legislation is badly needed because there are a
> great many offshore sites that are sucking billions of
> dollars from American households," said Rep. Bob
> Goodlatte, R-Va., who sponsored the bill."
>
> I suppose the next thing the US Government will ban is
> travel abroad for its citizens.  It's the logical
> conclusion after this absurdity, after all, US tourism
> abroad is liable to "suck billions of dollars from
> American households"...
>
> --
> Sincerely,
>
> Sotiris Sotiropoulos
>         Hermes Network Inc.
>         Toronto, Canada
>
> ----
> direct: 416.422.1034
>
> icq: 34564103
> --
> This message was passed to you via the [email-masked] list.
> Send mail to [email-masked] to unsubscribe
> ("unsubscribe ga" in the body of the message).
> Archives at http://www.dnso.org/archives.html

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------------------------------

End of GA-DIGEST V1 #1078
*************************